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    Left Back

    note: the way we've been exposed and penetrated again and again in this round, from this zone has many of us worried. since all this was against asia's B and C grade attackers. and somehow with the help of aghili and rahmati, we havent conceded as many goals as we shd have.

    we KNOW for sure, australians, saudis, japanese, koreans, ... will not be as forgiving and incompetent in converting this many chances offered to them. So while we have 2 and half months of time, we'd better address this issue today and find a resolution for it. coz once the second round starts, not only we wont have time for trials and experiments, we my fall behind too soon due to defensive failures, to be able to catch up later !

    ---------------------

    I dont like to see some "patch-up" attempt in posts that are crucial to TM's health and fate.

    Like LB.
    this post has been the most controversial and talked about post for a long time. Since we abandoned 3-5-2 and tried the 4 back system.

    Now, I totally understand we dont have a great left back in Iran.
    From what I have seen, we dont have a complete player for the post and all clubs try to make do with what they have and get the closest thing to a LB placed in their line ups.


    But I think we all can make the distinction that a club has a limited pool of players to pick from, while TM has the whole country & beyond.
    so what goes for the clubs shdnt go for TM.

    ----------------

    Now, who have been picked for the post in recent times? nosrati and zareh.
    hardly ppl like asadi, aghili, sadeghi were given a fraction of chances these two got and they were replaced by someone else.

    Does that mean these latter guys were so terrible?
    NO. coz , first of all, I dont recall, such loose and haphazard defending from any of these guys that I see from our current choice, zareh.
    so what is the reason for not seeing them there and seeing zareh instead?

    I can only assume things, as I'm not in the camp.
    one can say based on what we see everyday from the players. They express their worry and preferences in playing in a position and not in another post.
    Nosrati, for example, has said it many times that he is uncomfortable as LB, and would rather play central defense.
    we all know that is the absolute truth.
    the nosrati who played as LB is a far inferior player who plays the central defense so well.

    zareh, himself, plays in the midfield ( I believe it is the right , since I remember from branko days that he was a right midfield player for bargh ) and even recently, the game that brouhgt him back to TM, bargh-sepahan, he played and scored his goal(s) from the right midfield.

    why isnt he saying what nosrati has said?
    he certainly cant be thinking he can do justice to the post, after all these years of failures at LB.
    we see him in every game and it is ( shd be ) apparent.
    so is this desire to be in TM so strong that one is ready to flounder and fumble, but as long as he is in TM ?

    I dont blame the player here, coz ANY player would want to be a part of his nat'l team.
    the coach, however, shd know better and shd have the good of the TEAM in mind and nothing/noone else.


    ------------------

    I agree with those of us who say that extra pressure is put on poor zareh becoz our left midfield players dont track back and help in defense.
    ok. as right as that may be, we still have a left defense zone that is extremely weak and exposed time and again in every game.
    mere recognition of a part of the problem does NOT SOLVE it.

    we can either put a left mid who DOES track back and help.
    ( WHO ?
    - zandi cant run for more than 45 minutes and he hardly helps in defense .
    - hajsafi is young and may be able to do that, but he hasnt been trusted yet.
    - madanchi isnt such a defender either and hasnt even been called.
    - niki is the same as madanchi and cant defend or help in defense.
    so whom do we have ? )


    OR, we can play someone who is GOOD IN DEFENDING, at least.
    Zareh is NOT A DEFENDER. I hope everyone agrees here, otherwise the whole argument is moot.
    we all shd recognize the guy is NOT. A. DEFENDER.
    he doesnt play defender in his club even, for god's sake.

    ( if he's kept for any forward moves, then I'm afraid his passing forward has been failing him also. innumerable turn overs and loss of ball has dashed this argument)

    so I'd say lets play someone who can at least DEFEND well.
    and logic says , a DEFENDER , at least knows how to approach an attacker, what angles, what postures, .... the works.
    a midfielder goes about all those in a DIFFERENT manner. that's why zareh keeps getting rounded and passed by.

    yes, with a PURE DEFENDER, we may not get much service going forward .... but heck, with zareh we were NOT getting it anyway. so what's the difference anyway ?
    but with a PURE DEFENDER, we may get a noticeable degree of DEFENDING done in that zone, which secures our goal and does not tax aghili ( I think we all agree aghili is over-worked with constant covering for zareh as zareh is unable to block his man. hence that stretches our central defense apart and creates a space between aghili & hosseini, which many have used and WILL USE EVEN MORE in the next round )

    we have some defenders who actually play ( or have played on occasions ) in this post in their clubs.
    why do we overlook these and want to drag a right midfielder to the left defense?
    and continue to do so, while we clearly see this experiment has failed in its ( surprisingly ) numerous attempts ?

    #2
    Now, who do we have as options?

    I dont have a lot of ideas as one shd watch all the games in Iran, but I can deduct a couple of points for picking the candidate for LB:

    point 1 - the guy shd at least PLAY in this position in his club.
    zareh - does NOT.
    Asadi - DOES
    Nouri - DOES

    point 2 - the guy, while playing in his club, shd have somewhat an acceptable record
    Zareh - does NOT ( at LB )
    Asadi - DOES
    Nouri - DOES

    point 3 - the guy , while playing defense, shd show some attacking prowess as well, to satisfy any TM coach who may want forward moves from his LB's.
    Zareh - does , but at right midfield. as LB, his passing has failed badly.
    Asadi - does as well
    Nouri - does, and is the best of the lot, as he has played as a midfielder and playmaker as well, which shows his passing and forward moves are superior to the other two

    but the biggest surprise is that we dont see either ASADI or NOURI invited to TM !!!
    let me repeat: two players who have played as LB's in the clubs this season, and have had acceptable records in this very post , have not been even called to the camp, let alone given playtime !!!!!!!
    ( while a right midfield player, who .... you know the rest )

    how is that possible ?

    Comment


      #3
      I think Ale Nameh from Foolad who played in TM B in WAFF was also an option that wasn't given enough time to flourish. Even Badavi from SS ahwaz.
      "When I see the good in you, you get motivated, feel good about yourself and that creates synergy. It creates an environment where everybody can work better together. I think in the Iranian culture it becomes very ordinary to always see the bad in each other."
      Afshin Ghotbi ( Former TM Head Coach)



      Nasser Hejazi was the Takhti of our football.
      Mohammad Panjali (Former PP and TM Captain)
      sigpic

      Comment


        #4
        I don't know what you see in Nouri defensively.
        I saw few games where was LB and I was not impressed. he seems to be very slow. I remember the PP 1st leg game against SS-Ahwaz in Azadi. Meydavoodi was running circles around Nouri. also when they played ZobAhan, the little inexperienced kids were beating him.
        I'm sure you all remember that towards the end of the league, Nosrati was playing LB for PP.

        I don't remember seeing Asadi play, thanks to our very professional IRIB and the 5AM games in the winter. so I cannot comment on his play.

        but let me ask these question of those who saw him play, How do you see these "Alternative" LB's in maintaining the offside line? How do you rate their positioning? tackling abilities? ...

        It is easy for us to suggest names, but if our coaching staff have seen them play in the league. then they can judge better. Daei has coached against these teams and I'm petty confident he analyzed the strength and weakness of each player.
        If I'm not mistaken, Asadi was invited to the first TM under Daei. Now if they did not show potential in the league or the training camp, what good will it make to test them in a game except that us (the fans) may understand what is good or bad about a player?

        Comment


          #5
          ^ mrgood jan, the answer is very simple.

          even if these guys tackle once every 5 times attackers come at them, they are doing better than zareh.

          even if these guys pass forward , one time correctly out of every 5 attempts , they are doing better than zareh.

          yes, he has been THAT bad !
          -------------------

          as for inviting ppl to camp and not allowing them to play, my guess is as good as yours.
          but they HAVE SHOWN their potential in the league. the news during the league indicate that , even if the crappy irib doesnt show them.

          now, what happens in the camp?
          again neither of us are there to see.
          but let us give the benefit of the doubt to zareh.
          lets just say he does magnificently and wonderfully in training.
          lets just say he plays like we mix nesta + maldini's uncle + puyol's grandfather in training sessions.
          fine?

          but how does he play WHEN IT MATTERS , ie. the MATCH DAY ?
          he fails !

          now, if that happens the first time, we shd say ok, the coach didnt know.
          but if the coach repeatedly picks him for the GAMES and he repeatedly fails, then the coach has NO EXCUSE.
          no matter how zareh does in training, at the crunch time, he fails his duties.
          lets say he is ronaldinho & nesta & buffon & VNR and their cousins , all put together in his club and TM camp. but when he plays so poorly in TM GAMES, it is time for a change. maybe the guy has too much stress in official games. too much tension and he gets distracted or confused or .... whatever, I dont care. what I SEE in the games is a player who's not doing his job. whatever his reasons may be.

          isnt it time to allow others to show their stuff. and not the usual 20-30 minutes that serves noone.
          but get at least HALF the time ( we dont want too much . half would do ) such failing players get.
          have they got that much ?
          NO !!!

          ===================

          Ali jan, I know AlNemeh got the nod at waff and did quite well there.
          and frankly, I totally agree with you. both badavi and al nemeh , have played as LB in tandem at foolad. and everyone has described their season as successful.

          we cant even excuse daei for not trying his options in such a crucial post, by saying he doesnt look at the lower league ... coz he picks an out of form mirzapoor also !

          one would think he would be even MORE DILIGENT in those areas that TM has weakness, and the very FIRST post that comes to mind is LB !
          One would think he'd have made sure he leaves no stone un-turned !

          (....... oh, wait. I have a flashback !
          shades of 2005 ! is it dejavu ?
          havent we been here before ?
          the same argument and the same players involved?
          the same debate over "name" vs. "form" ?
          the same questions about illogical bias over a few players, no matter how poorly they play?
          about leaving out more deserving players while we see failures at LB and other areas ?
          ...... it's uncanny ! this could easily be Nov 2005 !!!! )

          -----------------

          what is curiously disturbing is Daei has worked with some really high class coaches in bayern's hietzfeld ( and I'm sure Hoeness & ... ) and hertha's Roeber and even arminia.
          but of all those great traits he could emulate from those coaches, he shows branko's lajbaazi and illogical selection!!! hah !

          Comment


            #6
            Payman Jaan,

            Is Badavi in SS ahwaz or Foolad? I thouht he played in SS Ahwaz last season. Didn't mean to change the topic but would love to know.
            "When I see the good in you, you get motivated, feel good about yourself and that creates synergy. It creates an environment where everybody can work better together. I think in the Iranian culture it becomes very ordinary to always see the bad in each other."
            Afshin Ghotbi ( Former TM Head Coach)



            Nasser Hejazi was the Takhti of our football.
            Mohammad Panjali (Former PP and TM Captain)
            sigpic

            Comment


              #7
              Both are in foolad. and badavi is the captain there.

              both have had a good season, earning ppl's praise.

              Alnemeh scored the goal against ss in hazfi semis, with a massive long ranger.

              Comment


                #8
                The way I think about it is that Daei is the coach and he should have complete authority in player selection. No self respecting coach will ever allow anyone to interfer in his player selection, as it is his most fundamental right. Whatever the reason for Daei's player selection is, I don't think anyone has the right to question it. Daei is a professional (Except when he deals with our cancerous media and rightfully so) and we should accept his decisions.

                My ideology is that to try finding out as to why Daei makes his selection of player and tactic rather than why he did not do.

                To summarize, I give Daei the benefit of the doubt.

                I was wondering in the past few days as what would have happened to Hiddink if he was Iran's coach and lost his first game 4-0 like what happened to Russia. anyone would like to put my mind to rest?

                Comment


                  #9
                  I absolutely agree that daei shd not listen to ppl like me. not only daei, but any coach. I'm just expressing my exasperation over these selections.

                  but I also expect Daei to go about things logically.
                  we have seen constant and repeated denial of reality got us nowhere in 2005.
                  we shd first accept there is a problem. denial doesnt allow that.
                  once we accept it, then we will go about solving it.

                  does Daei know or accept zareh's or X's or Y's performances?
                  believe me, I have tried what you said: to see what he sees about X or Y and why he persists with them. and have come up nearly EMPTY-HANDED!
                  cant really figure out how zareh's series ( AND HISTORY of ) horrible performances are going unnoticed or unattended when we DO HAVE alternatives that are , at least, worth trying out !
                  cant , at all.

                  I hope he does and does something about it.
                  coz as much as I like Daei and have supported him throughout his career, I LOVE TM MORE. and I will not stand any person putting his bias and personal grudges or illogical need for vindication ( of himself, his ideas or anyone else's ideas ) at the cost of TM.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Zare Shireh

                    Nosrati is a good backup. Still we have to keep on searching since it is our weakpoint-position. Asadi has obviously failed to impress Branko, GN and Daei, so we can write him off. Badavi has also been cut off already. Beikzadeh messed his chance up against Kuwait. Nouri in my eyes is not a good alternative, but maybe deserves a chance.

                    I must say the only interesting option I currently see is Sepahan's Jalal Akbari. He is young, leftfooted can play LB, LM, RM and even DM sometimes, has already played LB for Sepahan and Team Omid. He had some beef with Bonacic but came back strong under Vieira. He also is a fighter and was captain of Sepahan at young age already when Navidkia and M.Karimi were missing.

                    I doubt he will be able to do a much better job than Zare, but he's the only real option I see.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      The problem with Zare is that he sucks as a defender one on one. He also
                      had poor clears both against U.A.E and Syria. I agree with DD, against
                      quality strikers, he will get whooped. Unlike our TM which doesnt seem to
                      have a good knowledge of opponents weak/strong spots, you can be sure
                      they will bevpulling every freaking tape on our players and disect it to the bone.

                      Zares main positive and I think that's why they like him is that he covers
                      spaces well, at least better than most we have in TM.

                      Whatever happened to Ando playing in that position proposition?

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Look at the strongest defence team of this season.

                        Pas hamedan's Javad Shirzad is the best left footed defender.

                        His Freekick is good option too.

                        And i like Gholamreza Eidhizadeh and Zinadpour and Maniei.
                        My favorite Duo:Karimi & Kavianpour

                        Comment


                          #13
                          ^ I suggested ando for LB.
                          but there werent many who were enthusiastic about it !
                          My argument was : at least the guy can defend and hardly anyone goes past him. that ought to be a HUGE plus over zareh, who even I can get past him given 2-3 tries.
                          and you know we dont have many players in asia who can out-run ando.

                          ------------

                          shirzaad is an option. I forgot to include him in the polls.
                          I'm not sure about mani'ei or zeneidpoor though. while they are left footed and play on the left, that shd NOT be enough reason to play them in defense. that'd be only slightly more reasonable than putting zareh there.

                          but as I said we shd prioritize the options:

                          priority one:
                          the player shd be playing in this position in his club.
                          so he's familiar with the duties and requirements of this post. defending along the sideline is very different from defending in the middle or playing winger. requires different dynamics.


                          having satisfied # 1, we go to priority two:
                          the player shd have an acceptable record at defending.

                          once we have covered the above 2 points, priority three :
                          he shd be able to help in offense


                          merely being left footed cannot be the reason we play someone there. look at how zandi fared there !

                          zareh satisfies none of the above, hala har cheghadr khodemoon ro be dar o deevar bezanim !

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Are you guys talking about Zanidpoor who plays in Saipa? Isn't he an offensive player? Very good in carrying the ball and even good shooting from what I recall.
                            "When I see the good in you, you get motivated, feel good about yourself and that creates synergy. It creates an environment where everybody can work better together. I think in the Iranian culture it becomes very ordinary to always see the bad in each other."
                            Afshin Ghotbi ( Former TM Head Coach)



                            Nasser Hejazi was the Takhti of our football.
                            Mohammad Panjali (Former PP and TM Captain)
                            sigpic

                            Comment


                              #15
                              would like to see zandi tried out in that position for say 4-5 games
                              deerooz, emrooz, farda
                              zeeremonan
                              sheeshtayeea
                              The only dynasty of iranian football. ( At least three back to back championships define dynasty, we had moreTeam of the people by the people for the people that fills up 100k stadium like its nothing.
                              Future of true professional football if any in Iran!

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