In the event that Clemente fails to sign ...

[The-Red]

DD jan but what makes GN better than Jalali, Kazemi, Karimi or Korekandi??? I mean if we have to and I mean have to get some on in charge temprorary, I would certainly go with another Iranian coach, probably Jalali.

I really hope the spanish man signs the damn contract and becomes the coach.

[Doctor DOOM]

bro, I agree ghotbi has A PART of this success. no doubt.
but to say he only caused it is wrong. we can do this back and forth thing on how different the two rosters are and how much of a difference that would make in the outcome of the team or how it helps the team maintain the lead or .... . the estili factor was very much there last year , coupled with the parvin factor whihc is missing this year. last year pp faced WHOLE-SALE & repeated injuries in their defense line which caused a lot of shuffling to add to the already lousy roster. and a lot of other issues that are VERY different this year.
the truth of the matter is ghotbi, as you said, has just a part of it. and even then, he's not tested, therefore in MY books, not fit for national team.

and armin jan, the answer is nothing. he has nothing on those guys except that he's already worked with the team in recent history.
that's all.

[TM-Fan]

I would prefer a more educated coach like Dr. Zolfagharnasab who can at least get a better respect from the players and the media, besides, if his football skills is not more than GN, it definitely is not less than him.

I really don't like and don't trust a coach like GN in charge of team melli. He doesn't know how to behave in an international ground, does not understand the rules and does not know how to talk respectfully and logically. Remember how he wanted to take the TM players out of the field in a friendly and how he screwed up Esteghlal chances in ACL.

[gol_kuchik]

If we must choose a domestic coach, and the choices are between GN and Ghotbi, I would rather go with Ghotbi. I have no faith in GN rebuilding the squad and I firmly believe he will resort to his tactic of using big name players. Although I do believe he can navigate us out of this round...somehow.

Well, I have lost some confidence in Ghotbi. The reason isn't what some
say like "he already had a strong team" or "he was only analyst" or all the
other stuff one side of football mafia is pulling on the other side.

The main reason is, I was hoping he would look into IPL for young players to
recruit and develop at mid-season. Instead, it seems like he has his eyes on other
countries 2nd rate players. So his main concern is a patch job, as opposed
to a longer term vision for PP, which could have also served as a model
in Iran. Simply put, who has he discovered at mid-season?

That should also give you insight as what he will do at TM level, if he
were the coach: If in half a season he doesn't see anyone in Iran to recruit,
who will he bring to TM? Young, eager players or well known legioners?

As for Dr.Z, I think a domestic coach must have a good record in Iran. GN
is the best in Iran and I am afraid he is simply not good enough
at international level. We simply can't rely on any of our domestic coaches
plain and simple.

I mean how come we can all accept we don't have a world class referee domestically, and use international ref for important matches, but we insist we have world class coaches domestically? Think about it.

With players we have no choice

[maij]

I think bringing Ghotbi , with all the respect that I have for the man , is suicidal risk.

Why ?

1- He has very limited experience as a coach , and if the yardstick for his selection is the lone semi-achievement of topping the league in hi first full career appointment as a coach , then Ali Daei is way way more qualified.

2- Ghotbi , with his stern disciplinarian attitude has problems with a few of no-name so called PP players , how would he cope with the some of the indisciplined star players in team melli? He will be fire-fighting most of his time & wasting energy , rather than focusing m his real task.

3- One single advantage of Vatani coach is his familiarity with local players. Ghotbi has simply not been in Iran to have the edge on other vatani coaches.

[maij]

Again , when making such crucial decision as this Tem Melli coach selection , people should weigh all the pro's and cons of the candidates. Looking for the perfect man is a wild goose chase.

Certainly , Ghalenoei has his flaws but I find the young man quite an intelligent character despite his fiery outbursts. He can only learn from experience and his attitude has improved since. We all tend to cool down with age, GN like others should be given the benefit of the same doubt.

I personally don't favor , nice good mannered down to earth hayvallah coaches for Team Melli. Our culture is such that if disciplined is not applied the SH** will hit the fan. GN has proved that he is this type of man that accepts no-nonsense.

I don't agree that Team Melli lack of achievement in Malaysia was entirely GN's fault although in the post press conference , he took full responsibility for the failure, he in fact went all the way to praise all his players for their effort , despite the fact that many of them were below par and let him down.

I have come to know Ghalenoei quite closely in Malaysia , and I was surprised by what I have seen in him. In all honesty , I did not rate him very highly until the days before Asian Cup.....but a much closer look in the way that he dealt with he players , media and the game in general was an eye-opener.

If we are talking about options alas a temporary appointment , Amir Ghalenoi is right at the top. Another one that will not disappoint is Ali Daei.

The others that have been mentioned like Jalali or Zolfgharnasab could very well be good options as well , but in the former , I find a guy who is more theoretician than tactician and his claim in the newspapers that Iran will beat Syria 2-0 in Azadi , reduces his credibility in my opinion.

[Doctor DOOM]

well said majid jan. great post ^

especially the part " we all cool down with age" and let me add "with defeat" as well.

defeat to a brash, over-confident person is such a humbling experience that kick starts his maturity. GN was defeated at AC07. I beleive GN is more mature nowadays than a year ago.


I also agree looking for the perfect candidate in Iran is futile.
we shd look for the coach with the LEAST cons and weaknesses. in this, we may get someone. GN, karimi, Dr. Z and jalali are the ones that come to mind, for me.
and as I explained to armin jan, the ONLY factor that goes for GN is his recent work & history with the team. that's all.

[The-Red]

ghotbi should not be an option at the moment....however, Dr. Z as mentioned above and a few other irooni coaches could be considered for temp basis only.

[Adesor Vafaseya]

Again , when making such crucial decision as this Tem Melli coach selection , people should weigh all the pro's and cons of the candidates. Looking for the perfect man is a wild goose chase.

Certainly , Ghalenoei has his flaws but I find the young man quite an intelligent character despite his fiery outbursts. He can only learn from experience and his attitude has improved since. We all tend to cool down with age, GN like others should be given the benefit of the same doubt.

I personally don't favor , nice good mannered down to earth hayvallah coaches for Team Melli. Our culture is such that if disciplined is not applied the SH** will hit the fan. GN has proved that he is this type of man that accepts no-nonsense.

I don't agree that Team Melli lack of achievement in Malaysia was entirely GN's fault although in the post press conference , he took full responsibility for the failure, he in fact went all the way to praise all his players for their effort , despite the fact that many of them were below par and let him down.

I have come to know Ghalenoei quite closely in Malaysia , and I was surprised by what I have seen in him. In all honesty , I did not rate him very highly until the days before Asian Cup.....but a much closer look in the way that he dealt with he players , media and the game in general was an eye-opener.

If we are talking about options alas a temporary appointment , Amir Ghalenoi is right at the top. Another one that will not disappoint is Ali Daei.

The others that have been mentioned like Jalali or Zolfgharnasab could very well be good options as well , but in the former , I find a guy who is more theoretician than tactician and his claim in the newspapers that Iran will beat Syria 2-0 in Azadi , reduces his credibility in my opinion.

Well said and agree 100%

[gol_kuchik]

Certainly , Ghalenoei has his flaws but I find the young man quite an intelligent character despite his fiery outbursts. He can only learn from experience and his attitude has improved since. We all tend to cool down with age, GN like others should be given the benefit of the same doubt.

Yes, he can learn. But typically, someone who has screwed up like he did, will be given
some time off, and he has to prove himself over the course of a few years. There is no
shortcut for mending other than time and *proving* again you can be the head coach of
TM.

I personally don't favor , nice good mannered down to earth hayvallah coaches for Team Melli. Our culture is such that if disciplined is not applied the SH** will hit the fan. GN has proved that he is this type of man that accepts no-nonsense.

hmmm, proof please?

I don't agree that Team Melli lack of achievement in Malaysia was entirely GN's fault although in the post press conference , he took full responsibility for the failure, he in fact went all the way to praise all his players for their effort , despite the fact that many of them were below par and let him down.

This unfortunately is the kind of mentality in our culture, that leaves the person in charge
free of responsibility and ultimate accountiblity for his action. The players who performed
sub-par were HIS selection. He should take full responsibility. He had the choice to
make the subs. Did I miss something? Do we have to go over Asia Cup 2006 all over
again game by game to see how we got worse and not better as each game went by?

I have come to know Ghalenoei quite closely in Malaysia , and I was surprised by what I have seen in him. In all honesty , I did not rate him very highly until the days before Asian Cup.....but a much closer look in the way that he dealt with he players , media and the game in general was an eye-opener.

I don't doubt he knows his way around the league and with some players. But ultimately,
other than PR job, he needs to have a GAME plan. He simply showed his lack of
Football knowledge at international level.

Our disccusion isn't if GN can coach TM for the next game or two, he already showed (although not very convincingly, he can get us to round 4, but the problem is, if he does, then you will be hard pressed to replace him with an international level coach.

If we are talking about options alas a temporary appointment , Amir Ghalenoi is right at the top. Another one that will not disappoint is Ali Daei.

This is why I suggested Mazlomi, who coached our WAFF games. The problem is, anyone
famous like GN or Daei (more as a trainer than a coach), once in charge of TM with
success in 3rd round, can not be replaced.
First, they would not be smart enough to step down, second fans would get dillusional and
wont want them to step down.

3- One single advantage of Vatani coach is his familiarity with local players. Ghotbi has simply not been in Iran to have the edge on other vatani coaches.

Majid jan, regardless of Ghotbis familiarity with local players, I think we should be very
careful when choosing words like "Vatani" to describe some coaches vs others. I think
I know what your intention is, but please bare in mind, this is used by some in a divisive
manner (Khodi vs NoKhodi vs BeKhodi), and we should not inadvertantly help their cause.

[maij]

Yes, he can learn. But typically, someone who has screwed up like he did, will be given some time off, and he has to prove himself over the course of a few years. There is no shortcut for mending other than time and *proving* again you can be the head coach of TM.

Screwed up !!!!!!!!

we have gone through this argument a million times already , it is becoming very boring. All I can say that under GN , he managed to reach the quarter finals of Asian Cup , without losing a single match and his team managed to score , for heaven sake.... If that is your definition of screwing up , then we completely have different understanding of sport of football.....and I really cannot see how we can discuss such diverse views on the subject.

hmmm, proof please?

What is this.... a court of law ???

This unfortunately is the kind of mentality in our culture, that leaves the person in charge free of responsibility and ultimate accountiblity for his action. The players who performed sub-par were HIS selection. He should take full responsibility. He had the choice to make the subs. Did I miss something? Do we have to go over Asia Cup 2006 all over again game by game to see how we got worse and not better as each game went by?

YES...my friend , you missed a major issue.

Football is not a man one show, and no coach has got a magic wand to turn a team into championship material without the effort of the players , the administrators , foundation , structure and the list is long as my arm....that is what you have missed

I don't doubt he knows his way around the league and with some players. But ultimately,other than PR job, he needs to have a GAME plan. He simply showed his lack of Football knowledge at international level.

Sorry I can't comment about this , because I am not around or close to him to know weather he knows his way around the league or not.
About lack of knowledge of international , I don't agree with you but then again it is interesting to know how did you figure that one out....

Our disccusion isn't if GN can coach TM for the next game or two, he already showed (although not very convincingly, he can get us to round 4, but the problem is, if he does, then you will be hard pressed to replace him with an international level coach.

I can't figure out this one.... I thought you said he screwed up , yet you are saying that already showed he can get us to round 4 , through his lack of knowledge of international football !!!..... so , which is which ?

This is why I suggested Mazlomi, who coached our WAFF games. The problem is, anyone famous like GN or Daei (more as a trainer than a coach), once in charge of TM with success in 3rd round, can not be replaced.
First, they would not be smart enough to step down, second fans would get dillusional and wont want them to step down.

Mazloomi was part of Ghalenoei's team in Asian Cup07 ...I am not sure that he has enough experience as GN...but , Yes , he has the potential as well. He is another option than can be used but, I still rather have GN if shove comes to push.

Majid jan, regardless of Ghotbis familiarity with local players, I think we should be very careful when choosing words like "Vatani" to describe some coaches vs others. I think I know what your intention is, but please bare in mind, this is used by some in a divisive manner (Khodi vs NoKhodi vs BeKhodi), and we should not inadvertantly help their cause.

My Vatani means "Local" not as to label a person a patriot or non-patriot.

[maij]

well said majid jan. great post ^

especially the part " we all cool down with age" and let me add "with defeat" as well.

defeat to a brash, over-confident person is such a humbling experience that kick starts his maturity. GN was defeated at AC07. I beleive GN is more mature nowadays than a year ago.


I also agree looking for the perfect candidate in Iran is futile.
we shd look for the coach with the LEAST cons and weaknesses. in this, we may get someone. GN, karimi, Dr. Z and jalali are the ones that come to mind, for me.
and as I explained to armin jan, the ONLY factor that goes for GN is his recent work & history with the team. that's all.

Actually , Doc , Ghalenoei is far from arrogant when dealing with people. He did not seem to be anything like that , well at least not with me. In fact , he himself approached me to talk before I did......

To his credit , I think facing some of the extremely silly , out of line questions by Iranian press was a test of nerves for any person let alone a guy like him with short fuse. GN controlled his temper well during the press conferences , although I could feel the blood boiling inside him at some of the questions. What he needs to control is temper on the field , with players and referees....it was the latter that he came short.

BUT , I agree that the loss in Malaysia , hurt his pride and unfortunately we might never know if this made him a wiser person at TM level.

[khabalood]

How many actually believe GN will be able to rebuild the squad, and avoid using older superstar players?

How many believe he will play our players in their correct positions?

For that matter how many actually believe there would be no conflict between him and the players who underachieved during the Asia cup?

[maij]

How many actually believe GN will be able to rebuild the squad, and avoid using older superstar players?

I do

How many believe he will play our players in their correct positions?

This begs another question ....Who defines the correct position of each player ? The coach , the player himself , the fans or the media ?

For that matter how many actually believe there would be no conflict between him and the players who underachieved during the Asia cup?

I for one can not speculate on that....

[khabalood]

In regards to the second question, a position where the player can be beneficial to the team. For instance, Nikbakht at lb is not beneficial. It is a waste of an offensive talent, and inhibits the use of a proper lb who could help support the team defensively.

Anybody else care to answer?