Latest on Clemente

[gol_kuchik]

Doostan,

Now that the deal is off, we must remember that although it is somewhat
unusal to have a coach that does not live in the country where he is
coaching, in the case of Clemente *This Fact Was Known* prior to his
contract negotiation. We all know he did not live in Serbia, and whoever
did the negotiation, had to do the due deligence.

I am afraid this does fall in the incompetency depeartment.

When there is no planning, everything has to be treated as an emergency.
The 500 days with transition committe, the stonewalling, selfishness and stall tactics by
AliAbadi, it all is coming down to this.

I am becoming comfortably numb.

[zzgloo]

Niether , the head of the IFF, nor his immidiate assistants have ever been in football....only some have experince with other sports......so, they realy did not know how a coach needs to be interviewed......, and more over,....same thing with English language, or Spanish............as no one , realy has the command of any foerign langauges to truely understand the prospects , during any interviews.............
this was just a case of , " Not haveing experince of coaching", and not have the knowledge of a foerign language.
.................................................. ....
I vote for Ghotbi at this moment !
He almost has done what took ghalenoee to TM coaching ,( winning the league ), plus, has all neccessary experinces for our next tast !

[Doctor DOOM]

mates, I share ur views and anger at how ineffectual and incompetent our football officials have been.
I also blame the media for jacking up the pressure so much that neither party ( clemente in spain under spanish media, and IFF in Iran under Iranian media ) could show the least bit of compromise of flexibility, lest they are portrayed as weak by the media in their country!

I'm just frustrated at IFF who KNEW there was a possibility of this happening from a week or even 10 days ago, and still didnt have an alternative plan laid out ! they shd have started talking about and to other options in coaching by now, so in the event clemente doesnt sign, they'd immediately put those plans in motion and start the negotiations.
But apparently, according to kafashian, they are going to START the process of the SEARCH !!!!
just gets my goat !
what happened to their talks with santini, zeman, dechampes, .... etc?


as for TM, what it needs is a coach. and at this moment, ANY COACH would do.
believe me, what they need is someone to pick the players, lay down the system and tactics and get on with the all important process of coordination of the players.
right now the most vital issue is that the team gets playing time. our opponents are not that strong to warrant the need for high level tactics and strategy. In fact whatever our players know and can do is enough to help us qualify. all they need is to gel and get coordinated.

so I'd say just get someone to start the trainings at TM. anyone of the candidates would do. GN, Dr Z., karimi, ... even MK.

as I always said, in the meantime, IFF shd get on with their search and find a suitable coach and bring him in, even if it's in the middle of the first round. luckily, we have a gap between the kuwait game and the next 4 games. I'm hoping IFF would sign someone BEFORE the kuwait game and he can start immediately after the kuwait game.
that would leav us with a coach who has about a month and half of work with the players, but I'm assuming the league would be over or winding down by that time, so he'll have more time with the players.
that sounds good enough for me.


==============

bahram jan, ghotbi "almost" getting what Gn did shd be enough reason for NOT wanting him at this stage.
look at it this way: GN actually WON the league ( not the half season. not just did well for some 17-18 games. but actually WON THE LEAGUE ) and that too after 3 years when SS came second in the year previous. THAT is FAR FAR better than just topping the tables for 17-18 games.

comparing GN with ghotbi, DIRECTLY, just doesnt sound fair.
now, we add this "almost" ... we see why we shd NOT think about ghotbi as a candidate now.

[gol_kuchik]

mates, I share ur views and anger at how ineffectual and incompetent our football officials have been.
I also blame the media for jacking up the pressure so much that neither party ( clemente in spain under spanish media, and IFF in Iran under Iranian media ) could show the least bit of compromise of flexibility, lest they are portrayed as weak by the media in their country!

I'm just frustrated at IFF who KNEW there was a possibility of this happening from a week or even 10 days ago, and still didnt have an alternative plan laid out ! they shd have started talking about and to other options in coaching by now, so in the event clemente doesnt sign, they'd immediately put those plans in motion and start the negotiations.
But apparently, according to kafashian, they are going to START the process of the SEARCH !!!!
just gets my goat !
what happened to their talks with santini, zeman, dechampes, .... etc?
.......................

This is what we get when one candidate is left to run. It is amazing that
Kafashian did not restart the search 10-days ago. It is also amazing we
lost yet another week. I said in the start of this thread, Clemente is doing
the stall tactic. The dumb-ucks who are in charge fell for it. I am so
disgusted. Usually the feeling that I got punched in the belley comes right
around final stages of competition, like WC or Asian Cup, thanks to Kafashian
it arrived early.

[BehzadB]

It doesn't make sense to start negotiations with other coaches when you are so close to signing someone like clemente...

Other coahces wouldn't take you serious when you do that.. at least not a self respecting coach..

[Doctor DOOM]

.... and to think we already HAD a coach , all signed and ready to come to Iran and take the helm : ARTUR JORGE !!!
and some bastard idiot had to go and cancel it !!!
it just kicks you in the nut, no?

[gol_kuchik]

This thread has come to a sad close. I'll update the more relevant one now.

[zzgloo]

so I'd say just get someone to start the trainings at TM. anyone of the candidates would do. GN, Dr Z., karimi, ... even MK.

=======

bahram jan, ghotbi "almost" getting what Gn did shd be enough reason for NOT wanting him at this stage.
look at it this way: GN actually WON the league ( not the half season. not just did well for some 17-18 games. but actually WON THE LEAGUE ) and that too after 3 years when SS came second in the year previous. THAT is FAR FAR better than just topping the tables for 17-18 games.

comparing GN with ghotbi, DIRECTLY, just doesnt sound fair.
now, we add this "almost" ... we see why we shd NOT think about ghotbi as a candidate now.

Payman jaan.................first of all, I do love you !! ( don't get homophobic with me again ! )
Your contradictory statements above.......shows once again, once you don't like a man, you foolforcely campain against him !!
since that " almost " bothers you, does that mean, if Ghotbi actualy wins the league, you will change your opnion about him ? is that the only holding point for you ?.................
With 6 point reduction off PP, and being the first year in Iran after twenty some years.....not knowing any opponanats, and more, he still is " almost" doing it ! ,,and ..............with all this situations, and , going with your statement, any one at this moment would do,......still , will be mistake ??to get the job to ghotbi ??...............
What has he done to deserve your anger ?
I am " TAJI " by heart, but I still think, this guy is worth the try !....
He wants this Job bad, and he has worked hard, and he has accomulated many neccessary experinces we need.. spacialy compaire to other choices we have localy !.................give him a chance payman Jaan. and " Az khare shaytan bia paeen " !!

[Doctor DOOM]

bahram jan, LOL.
I too, love you like a Brother, btw.


well, I've already said it many times.
ghotbi and ppl like him ( even daei ) need to be put through the TRIAL and process of "shaping/hardening into a good reliable HEAD coach".

just one championship does not automatically qualify a coach to lead a NATIONAL TEAM. it qualifies them for a club, however.

both daei and ghotbi are very promising and full of potential for great coaching. but the NATIONAL TEAM is a different ball game. becoz in that situation, you dont face coaches like misaghian, taghavi, ... or even Dr Z or karimi. you face guys like Advocaat, hiddink or paqueta or .... who are well known INTERNATIONAL Grade A or B coaches.

so just becoz ghotbi mostly ( not even always ) overcomes a misaghian or a peyrovani, it shd not mean he can deal with the likes of those int.l coaches.

GNs case may be different just becoz he had coaches for about 4 or more years and in the last 3 years with ss, he once came second and the next year he won the trohpy.
now, that you cant compare with ghotbi who hasnt even finished his FIRST YEAR as a head coach ... let alone he hasnt won anything also.

I have climbed off the satans donkey ... just for the flower of your face. ( lol before it sounds too gay, I must say I translated "be khatereh gol-e rooye to" )
I say we can even trust ghotbi for the first round, AS LONG AS IFF SEARCHES AND SIGNS A CONTRACT WITH A GOOD INT.L COACH IN THE MEANTIME, EVEN IF IT IS IN THE MIDDLE OF THE FIRST ROUND.
But we definitely and most certainly will be in deep trouble if we go to the second round with the likes of karimi, Dr z, GN...let alone ghotbi !

secondly, who am I to agree or disagree with the appointment of a coach, bro?
It's not as if IFF is coming here and asking us for advise ( wish they did, coz I'm sure ppl at pfdc would have better advises and ideas than most of those morons at the fed'n !! ).
I'm just saying I , personally, dont like such things.

and I'm most certainly not "angry" at him. I just think he's under-qualified to lead a national team.

[maij]

Perhaps I am the odd one out, but I do not share the dooms and glooms of Iranian football after the sudden or slow death of the contract with Clemente. I have lots of reasons but suffice to mention a few for argument sake.

1) The notion that the likes of Clemente will save Iran's football is exaggerated to say the least.

2) The IFF and other sport organizations needs to have a long term plan , using FIFA resources amongst many others, to improve the overall standard of football , the foundation , the organization & planning and last but not least , develop a highly skillful cadre of national trainers.

3) Clemente's demands were totally unreasonable. Simply, he could not have done his job right if he was not fully dedicated to it, at least not at this period where the National Team is in dire need of professional attention.

4) Clemente , as good of a coach as he is , has never actually won any accolades at International level coaching a national team (Spain & Serbia)

5) Clemente’s latest venture has proven to be a letdown when he failed to qualify to the European Championship with Serbia, alas using the same methods of remote control coaching.

6) There are hundreds of other coaches in the World. IFF and the country in general should not be held ransom by some unusually cunning and irrational demands.

7) Apart from World Cup 2006, Iran has made it in 2 other occasions with local coaches. The thought of having a Foreigner for Team Melli coach does not necessarily guarantee passage to the World Cup as we have experienced with Blazevic.

8) There is far too much emphasis on the role of coaches in football. The greatest coach in the world can be let down by poor performances of players and disorganization.


It would have been nice to have Clemente and interesting to see his work, but NOT at any price. I raise my hat to IFF.

[Doctor DOOM]

I agree with majid jan's statements ... except # 4 definitely and slightly on # 5.

#4- well that's a relative matter.
while he may not have been such a over-whelming influence on the european sides, even that much influence for a team like Iran would certainly BE over-whelming and highly progressive.

#5 - yes, he failed. but serbia was in a rather tough group with romania ( a very good team and I think czek rep ,another great team ( or was it poland? )? and came third, right after these two.

[zzgloo]

I also agree with maij , ....
How ever, this ' thrust ', was something commendable......a thrust of, not settleing with a 3 rd.grade coach...and not getting behind the South Korean, or australian Football federations in level of coaches they hire .
All other candidates, as well as the coaches of japan or Korea,or even Australia have never exactly had the resume' of Clemente.......such coaches, whom clemente might have been , are usualy a little more exentric than others..
although , wanting to stay more in Spain was a little non-commital...nevertheless,IFF needs to be more accumidating, and prepared with coaches of higher class !

[maij]

The fact that IFF or Kafashin ( dont matter to me who gets the credit) have actively engaged in a recruiting a high level coach such as Clemente , is commendable. It also refutes all the allegations that IFF ( or PEO) are after a local coach for Team Melli.

They (IFF) tried their best and I have no quarrels with their decision in refusing to bow to the demands of a coach who wants to create a training methodology that simply is not acceptable in concept or practice.

[gol_kuchik]

This is simply astonishing. I can't believe what I read,
IFF should now be given a medal for twice in two months, giving a contract to two
different coaches, contracts which THEY PREPARED and then failed to respect in
the case of Jorge, and amended and amended in the case of Clemente?
If Kafashian, didn't know 3 weeks ago when Clemente was in Iran
when Clemente states he told IFF on Day one, that he won't be living in Iran, and Kafashian failed to capture that in the contract *IFF* prepared, now he is your hero?
Folks, with all due respect you are seriously confused. IFF, and Kafashian are not
simply incompetent THEY SIMPLY DONT GIVE A DAMN They ignored what Clemente told them. They don't
care how dimissing their own contract with Jorge looks to the world.

Now let's celebrate, we will choose from the great domestic coaches. We showed
both Clemente and Jorge how principled we are.

[maij]

This is simply astonishing. I can't believe what I read,
IFF should now be given a medal for twice in two months, giving a contract to two
different coaches, contracts which THEY PREPARED and then failed to respect in
the case of Jorge, and amended and amended in the case of Clemente?
If Kafashian, didn't know 3 weeks ago when Clemente was in Iran
when Clemente states he told IFF on Day one, that he won't be living in Iran, and Kafashian failed to capture that in the contract *IFF* prepared, now he is your hero?
Folks, with all due respect you are seriously confused. IFF, and Kafashian are not
simply incompetent THEY SIMPLY DONT GIVE A DAMN They ignored what Clemente told them. They don't
care how dimissing their own contract with Jorge looks to the world.

Now let's celebrate, we will choose from the great domestic coaches. We showed
both Clemente and Jorge how principled we are.

No disrespect , but you seems to know every detail of the contracts from day one !

Unless I am way off , I think you like the rest of us , got your information from the press. And unless I am mistaken , none of the journalist had seen the actual contract , initial or the so-called amended one....And most importantly , correct me if I am wrong , but Clemente has stated to Iranian and foreign press (Reuters) , that he has no problem living in Iran.....So, what makes you think that Clemente changed his mind , NOT IFF??

Even if Clemente decides to live in Spain and tells IFF of his plan , IFF in its own right is fully entitled to say NO and add a clause that requires him to be present in Iran.

Hell , how many times that IFF has faced such a situation , where a guy wants to be paid sitting in his villa in the sun ??

I have yet to make my opinion about Kafashian , it is early days for me to formulate an opinion on his competency , but his first real challenge has impressed me.

Have a bit of pride in your country and compatriots. How do you accept a person to be in charge of Team Melli , when he does not want to live and work there???

About Jorge , we all know that Kafashian was not a party in signing him. Again , he has the right , being the accountable person , to reject the contract.

I am seriously NOT confused. I am seriously sane and in IFF present administration , I can safely say that they have done the right thing. Just because you don't agree on their action , does not make them incompetent. OR do you label anyone whom you disagree with as incompetent ???