Iran vs. UAE Game [merged]

[Amin_]

Ehhh doctor jaan, in harfaro nazan, Panama had a player who played in the English 3rd division and Lybia had drawn Egypte 20 decades ago, THESE ARE WORLD CLASS TEAMS!

We should all send Branko some flowers for having drawn and even beaten some of these WORLD CLASS TEAMS IN AZADI

And not to even mention QPR, I mean they even had 11 players and a 23 men roster of players from the ENGLISH 3RD DIVISION, I mean hat'ta az Panama-ham behtar boodan
I thanked God we had Branko, cause he was the only man who could keep the score reasanably down to only a defeat by 3 goals

[yashar_fasihnia]

Ehhh doctor jaan, in harfaro nazan, Panama had a player who played in the English 3rd division and Lybia had drawn Egypte 20 decades ago, THESE ARE WORLD CLASS TEAMS!
We should all send Branko some flowers for having drawn and even beaten some of these WORLD CLASS TEAMS IN AZADI
And not to even mention QPR, I mean they even had 11 players and a 23 men roster of players from the ENGLISH 3RD DIVISION, I mean hat'ta az Panama-ham behtar boodan
I thanked God we had Branko, cause he was the only man who could keep the score reasanably down to only a defeat by 3 goals

banamak! we didnt even play 4-2-3-1 against QPR. looks like u dont even know wat the discussion is about but just decided to jump in to make ur usual negative remarks about branko

if thats the case, we beat bosnia 2-1 & 5-2 and tied croatia 2-2 (they have players in top teams from top leagues of the world) under the same branko u cant stand seeing him being given some credit

just to enlighten u now that u decided to jump into the discussion to find fault with anything related to branko, we were talking about TM playing 4-2-3-1 formation and the results they got. but its ok, u enjoy belittling some of our players and coaches like some people. go ahead and do that if it makes u feel happy. afterall, iranian football is used to all kind of mockery of players and coaches and putting down others and their work.

-----------

like i said, can anyone here please provide me all the games we played AGAINST QUALITY OPPONENTS OF DOCTOR DOOM OR AMINs STANDARDS WITH THE 4-2-3-1 FORMATION? HOW MANY DID WE PLAY AND WAT WERE THE RESULTS??

if im not mistaken, we started playing 4-2-3-1 formation ever since andranik teymourian proved himself and earned himself a TM spot. before that, we used to play 4-4-2 diamond with daei and hashemian upfront, karimi behind them, zandi on left, kia on right and nekounam as DM.


teymourians debut match was against libya on 24 august 2005. so im assuming that we started playing 4-2-3-1 since that game.

here is the list of TM games since that date until the last game against angola which we played under branko in worldcup 2006

Iran 4:0 (2:0) Libya
24/08/2005 TEHRAN Friendly

Korea Republic 2:0 (1:0) Iran
12/10/2005 SEOUL Friendly

Iran 2:0 (1:0) Togo
13/11/2005 TEHRAN Friendly

Iran 4:0 (1:0) Chinese Taipei
22/02/2006 TEHRAN Continental Qualifier

Iran 3:2 (3:1) Costa Rica
01/03/2006 TEHRAN Friendly

Croatia 2:2 (1:1) Iran
28/05/2006 OSIJEK Friendly

Iran 5:2 (3:2) Bosnia-Herzegovina
31/05/2006 TEHRAN Friendly

Mexico 3:1 (1:1) Iran
11/06/2006 NUREMBERG FIFA World Cup™ Final

Portugal 2:0 (0:0) Iran
17/06/2006 FRANKFURT/MAIN FIFA World Cup™ Final

Iran 1:1 (0:0) Angola
21/06/2006 LEIPZIG FIFA World Cup™ Final


we beat libya, bosnia (twice), costa rica and togo.
we drew with croatia.
we lost to korea, mexico and portugal.

now please tell me wat ur argument is? that 4-2-3-1 won only against weak teams but didnt win against strong teams??

and u were expecting us to beat portugal and mexico? mexico we played great with the same 4-2-3-1 formation until the 60th minute where we ran out of stamina.

now, we played 1 friendly against korea in korea and we lost. does that justify the failure of the 4-2-3-1 system? how many other games did we have of DOCTOR DOOM OR AMINS quality and lost with the 4-2-3-1 system that they are making such claims? those are the games we played, and those are the results we got. u be the judge urself.

does beating bosnia 5-2 & 2-1, libya 4-0, costa rica 3-2, togo 2-0 and drawing croatia 2-2 on their own their own turf when the referee GIFTED THEM a 93rd minute penalty NOT SAY ANYTHING?? so all these teams were weak according to DOCTOR DOOM AND AMIN or do they think that these results were not good enough for the 4-2-3-1 formation i wonder?? how many teams of DOCTOR DOOMS and AMINS HIGH STANDARDS did we play with the 4-2-3-1 system in the first place that they are ridiculing the wins against teams like libya??

[Amin_]

banamak! we didnt even play 4-2-3-1 against QPR. looks like u dont even know wat the discussion is about but just decided to jump in to make ur usual negative remarks about branko

Guess you need to learn to see the difference between a serious discussion (like we've been having over those long posts) and a joke/shookhi/fooling around/ice breaking-post with tons of smilies and sarcasm in it.

FYI I do know what the discussion is all about, and even if I didn't, I still could and should be able to jump in whenever I want for a little joke and some ice breakers!

You don't need to write me a whole new shahname again for that post of mine!

And please go learn the difference between criticism and "negative remarks" and then come here to say all that. Criticizing Branko/Daei/Qn or whoever for their systems/tactics doesn't mean I'm wishing them dead or that I'm only "making negative comments".

For you to interpret that joke/ice breaker like the way you did and to come up with remarks as "you don't know what it's all about and you jump in (bebakhshid keh azetoon avaal sa'al nakardam, I didn't know this forum and these discussions were only for you and DD ) with your usual negative remarks" (lol, again bebakhshid keh aghayeh Branko-ro criticize kardam ), says al lot...



PS: Aslan for the sake of discussion: ok we didn't play 4-2-3-1 against QPR, still aghayeh Branko was the coach and we lost with him sitting on the bench!!!!

And btw, I used QPR so I could make my
"Panama had 1 player form the English 3rd division (this was a joke as well, before you start writing 3 pages again about how Panama didn't have any players playing in England lol) and QPR had even a 23 men roster from the English 3rd disvision, so they were even better than the World Class Panama"- joke.

PPS: Have a good time with your discussion and sorry for jumping in without knowing anything, you all-knowing-prophet

[The-Red]

only if some ppl in the IFF and in the system cared as much as some of us on this forum...I recommend the Football plus forum members for the next IFF election...we would have a shot at making the wc 2014

[The-Red]

oh btw, not to distract anyone from the serious topic on hand, but is so cool seeing two ss hardcore fans go at it and argue each other (amin and yashar) lol so unusual...come on guys,,,where is the unity
sry folks, keep up the discussions.

[Amin_]

And sorry , I couldn't hold myself in:

* Yeah I guess all those times before Ando came when Alavi used to play DM, or even Golmo, those all happaned in one of my dreams (or nightmares?)that I used to have about Branko every night.

* Yes aghayeh Yashar khan, Portugal and all these weak Arab countries are the same
We should play the same system ALL THE TIME, no matter who our opponent is.

Iran vs. Brazil --> 4-2-3-1

Iran vs. Libanon/UAE/Kuwait... in Azadi --> 4-2-3-1



That's what I meant with lack of flexibility, but I don't blame you if you don't see any difference here and I bet you will find something to counter attack, but it's all good, I have said what I needed to and I don't feel like continuing this discussion (cause apparently it wasn't meant for me ). So you can have the last word and feel "proud" about it

Once again: Sorry for having jumped in your knowledgeable discussions with my lack of knowledge, please forgive me

[Amin_]

heheh Armin jaan, waghti resid be TM, "color molor" wa "EsEs MesMes" ma saremoon nemishe

TM comes above all!

Then Esteghlal



And last and least of course there's PP

[RaginG Inferno]

People have roo dar vaysi with Daie. UAE is the same team that our team melli under GN beat them twice last year 2-1 and 1-0 (in UAE) and see how they outplayed us in Tehran.

Absolutely right. Ghalenoei was definitely not perfect, but his performance was far superior to what has been shown by Ali Daei so far.

I am of the basic opinion that Ali Daei needs much more experience before attempting to coach Iran. It's a shame we lost Clemente; he slipped through our fingers. Iran needs a coach that can impose a completely different system of play in our team. The problem is fundamental, the system needs to go.

I am of the feeling that Iran's players are very undisciplined in their tactical play. I would kill to give this team over to Guus Hiddink!

[yashar_fasihnia]

Dear Innocent victimized bigonah Amin,

1) im sorry but when ur sarcastic comments are directed towards one member and supporting another member, its no longer a shookhi or an ice breaker! az poshte kooh naymadim amin agha, nor was i born yesterday. i have had several discussions with u and i have seen ur previous " sarcastic jokes and ice breakers" as well!
looks like im not the one who has to go somewhere and learn something...

2) i didnt say u need my permission to jump into a discussion. i said, U DONT EVEN KNOW WAT THE TOPIC IS BUT U JUMP IN AND MAKE SOME ARGUMENTS WHICH HAVE MINIMAL RELEVANCE! IF U CLAIM U DO KNOW WAT THE ARGUMENT WAS, THEN HOW COME UR EXAMPLES WERE ALL IRRELEVANT? SO DOES THAT MEAN UR INFO WHICH U USE TO SUPPORT UR CLAIMS ARE WRONG? it can mean either of the 2, either u didnt know wat the topic was, or u knew wat the topic was but ur supporting argument and example were wrong! i cant think of a 3rd reason why u would provide wrong examples!

looks like u need to read my posts more carefully, before telling me i posted another shahname for u.

3)when we were playing with Alavi as DM, we still didnt play 4-2-3-1. we might have played with more than 1 DM, but we didnt play 4-2-3-1!

4)even u r panama example, we didnt play 4-2-3-1! so ur argument is still irrelevant like i said! u enjoy ridiculing TMs victories under branko while making a big thing of TMs losses, so im not surprised as history previously has shown since i myself have had many discussions with u before. I dont need to go anywhere to learn the difference between criticisms and negative remarks, thankyou.Your sarcastic post was not criticizing (neither was it an icebreaker), its making negative remarks and ridiculing. wins against the other teams are either too insignificant or the opponent is to weak for u, but the loss in friendlies are major catastrophies and made a big deal ofand ofcourse, performance against bosnia and croatia, u nicely ignore like before when we had similar arguments but anywayz, this discussion is not about branko's results. its about 4-2-3-1 and its "failure" like u and doctor doom claimed which i provided counter examples and u guys are yet to provide sufficient arguments and examples for ur claims!

5)again, like i said, u either dont read my posts carefully or u havent followed the discussions here cos I NEVER SAID PORTUGAL AND ARABS ARE THE SAME AND WE SHOULD PLAY 4-2-3-1 ALWAYS! i even said my own preference is 4-4-2 diamond but i would understand if TM palys 4-2-3-1 given the current circumstances! even in the thread in football forum where someone asked if teymourian - nekounam combo is good, i said, sometimes yes, sometimes no.
both in football and football forum, i have mentioned it several times, even in threads u were involved about this, but looks like, ONCE AGAIN (how surprising ), U DIDNT READ IT OR IGNORE IT OR FORGOT IT OR I DUNNO WAT... BUT MADE UR OWN CONCLUSIONS FROM MY SIDE ABOUT MY OPINION!


Sincerely yours,
The "all knowing prophet" who forgives u, not for jumping into a discussion, but jumping into a discussion with wrong info or not having enough info about wat the discussion was about.

[yashar_fasihnia]

oh btw, not to distract anyone from the serious topic on hand, but is so cool seeing two ss hardcore fans go at it and argue each other (amin and yashar) lol so unusual...come on guys,,,where is the unity
sry folks, keep up the discussions.

armin jan

do u see any unity in our football? do u see any unity anywhere in iran? why do u expect anything else now? if we had any unity in out football, would our football be so miserable??

[Ali Chicago]

Adel Ferdousipour asked Clemente on Navad: "what formation will you use (or prefer)"... Clemente responded: "..first tell me who has the ball.."..

that's what football is all about guys, not formations...

Transitional football is where we need to improve on.. going from defense to offense, and vise versa

I can't help remembering ghotbi's famous phrase, "sazemandehee teamee"..

he used that phrase a lot early on.. that's the area we are lacking big time.. and that starts with our defenders.. once we have the right defenders in there, we can get the offense going..

how much offense did any one of our defenders orchestrate today?
How many times did Zareh, Aghili, jalali or Kaabi jump start or initiated an attack?
How does playing with 2 forwards, make our midfield or defenders play better??
How does playing with 1 less midfielder , make our offense better?

by the way, today, Daie made slight changes to his formation, and if you wonder why UAE team had full control of the midfield for such long periods of time, you may want to count your forwards..

Very breif yet to the point. Thank you.

[zzgloo]

armin jan
do u see any unity in our football? do u see any unity anywhere in iran? why do u expect anything else now? if we had any unity in out football, would our football be so miserable??

yashar jaan.........
I frankly, as a " TAJI ",or ss fan.....for some unscientific reson , have more in common with SS fans such as you and lets say,ali-chicago, than PP fans....
I am not being partial here, I realy agree with thier type of thinking than PP fans, in General..........and I can not explain why.............
although, there are exceptions.....as in your case with amin , but ....I prefer SS fans any time !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This accualy could be a topic of thread of its own.......as there is some psycological bonds for some fans to choose one team over another.

[Ali Chicago]

Now that Iran won I guess everythign will be pushed under the rug. That is who we are, if we loose, make the fire squad ready, and if we win, everythign must be ok. No wonder the so called sons and daughters of Koroush and Dariush, were for 8 years in war with a country of 17 millions and toward the end we had to drink the so called "cup of poison".

Regardless best of luck to the TM (Mr. Daie and players). These posts between Amin and Yashar reminds me of my long long posts during the WC with Yashar and amazingly today we are even in worst shape than then.

Yashar jaan, Doctor and many others tried to tell you, nobody is saying 4-2-3-1 is bad. God forbid, if anyone has such a claim. All people are trying to say is the following two points:
4-2-3-1 if both of our mids are in in top form isn't helping us.
Furthermore, none of our forwards are good enough to be able to play alone upfront. You saw on Saturday, having Rezai given free reign to move left and right and add from wings helped us quite a bit.


It seems your passion and hearth felt for the past events in the TM prevents you to see what people are saying and you focusing on merits of 4-2-3-1.
Football isnt' like Basketball that coach can call timeout and have such a direct influence on the team performance during the game. These systems are more like a guideline and theoric discussion about merits or demerits of each is more suited toward coaching classes and contraversy in the newspapers after the game to analyze the coach.

Remember Angola or T&T what system did they play in the WC. Angola tied the same mighty Portugal 0-0 and lost to Mexico 1-0 if I am not mistaken. Did they play 4-2-3-1? It comes to a lot of other thing (physical conditioning, pschological readyness, team chemistry and one of those elements can be team formation). So I suggest we dont' get hooked up on team formation only.

[Amin_]

Aghayeh yashar Khaneh all-knowing prophet,

Please allow me, a person who doesn't know anything to jump in again, ba ejazeh:


1) I guess as the person who's made that shookhi post, I know better than you whether it was a particularely meant as a joke or whether it was serious (it wouldn't surprise me if you claimed you did know even this better than me though ).

I even said that Panama had a player playing in the English league and that Libya drew Egypt 2 decades ago...once again, these were no facts and all was said as a joke/ice breaker about our "mighty" victories about these world class teams.

Of course some of it was to somehow show that these wins don't mean much except for adding to Branko's "impressive" stats...same as the QPR friendly which didn't mean much in reality either, neither as our match with Qn against Mexico etc...I specifically used QPR because I'd made that joke about "Panama having a player in England", so that I could use the "But QPR even has 23 men in England"- joke after that.


2) Please, as someone who's made the longest post in this thread and has been following all the discussions, you don't need to tell me what the discussion is about.

Even if my joke was irrelevant to the subject, still, so what?! It wasn't a serious post anyway. If you want to see the difference between my serious posts and jokes, perhaps you should look at the long post again, and I'm sure even you than can see the difference...
If you still don't see the difference between my serious posts and that one, then perhaps you really should check whether you really "az poshte kooh nayoumadi"

I don't even remember which 11 started in the match against QPR, or Panama, so how can I make a serious post about those games?! Again, I also mentioned Panama having a player in England and that Libya drew Egypt, both are things I made up, and are no facts at all, but it was all in the sense of the shookhi post/ice breaker, so how can you even suggest that my post was serious?!?!

If I was about to make a serious post about it, I'd made sure I knew every detail about it, which means I would research first what formation and players we used in all those games I mentioned etc. and if it was meant to be serious I wouldn't say things as Panama had a player in England and Libya drew Egypt without having checked some reliable sources first!!

3) Actually we did play 4-2-3-1 few times (not all the time though) when Alavi and Golmo played there! 4-2-3-1 wasn't introduced to TM after Ando's presence! And still, even if it wasn't 4-2-3-1, still my point is that playing with 2 DM's in general at home against weak opposition is not right imo!

4) Even if I was ridiculing the wins over mighty Panama and Lybia, which only added to Branko's stats, still I'd have a point, as these were not impressive at all. Same as the loss against QPR, even though we lost heavily, still it was our B team and the loss didn't mean much. Same as the loss with our B team in Mexico under Qn, same as...

The draw against Croatia was impressive and the sysytem worked there against a tougher opponent; I give credit where its due and criticize where I think it's justified!
Please refer to # 2, I've had enough of repeating the same sh!t all over again!

5) This goes back to the discussion of being flexible and it has everything to do with the formation that is always used, no matter who our opponents are! It doens't have anything to do with your preferences! When I give the Brazil/Portugal vs. Libanon/UAE-Libya... as examples, it's to point out that playing against much weaker opposition, specially at home, who're playing with only 1 offensively minded player, is a totally other story than playing against Portugal/Mexico or Brazil!


Again, even if my intention was to ridicule some of the victories (which perhaps was for a little part of my post, even though it was mostly just meant as a joke/ice breaker), it's because many use to brag about these insignificant victories over those crappy teams and people like to add these to Branko's stats and call it "impressive", yet at the same time many "forget" to mention the losses and forget to mention how crappy most of these teams were, and act as if teams like QPR are world class Again, I give credit where its due, like against Croatia, but I'll criticize where I think it's necessary at the same time!


I've had enough of this discussion, please write another page full and whatever it is you're going to write, you are right ok?

Sincerely yours,

The nothing-knowing-binamak-who-likes-to-jump-into-discussions-without-having-read-any-posts-and-without-knowing-what-the-whole-discussion-is-all-about.



PS: As a matter of fact, I take my apologies back, since it seems you are "forgiving" me for the wrong things, since I did not jump into the discussion without having read any of the posts and I did know what the discussion was all about!

[yashar_fasihnia]

yashar jaan.........
I frankly, as a " TAJI ",or ss fan.....for some unscientific reson , have more in common with SS fans such as you and lets say,ali-chicago, than PP fans....
I am not being partial here, I realy agree with thier type of thinking than PP fans, in General..........and I can not explain why.............
although, there are exceptions.....as in your case with amin , but ....I prefer SS fans any time !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This accualy could be a topic of thread of its own.......as there is some psycological bonds for some fans to choose one team over another.

hmm,, bahram jan,,,its great to hear that kinda unity or brotherhood or watever u wanna call it is there in u towards esteghlalis, im sure its there in many people and most fans here, but there must be some kinda disagreements between u and other esteghlali fans as well,

im guessing its some kind of subconcious bias created in us when we discuss matters?

for example, a good way of testing urself to actually see if there is any subconcious partiality which even u dont realize is something like this: imagine if u didnt know, me or amin or ali_chicago or some other taji is discussing a certain issue with some non taji, would u still have the same opinion about the 2 peoples arguments after u found out one of them is taji?

its difficult to say now, cos now u know who is esteghlali and who isnt, but it would be interesting to see the outcome of such an experiment if it ever happens spotaneously
meanwhile, we stand united makhsoosan after todays loss in rasht!
we got 90 minutes to take a U-turn and go to ACL, unless talebloo saves us in penalties again

again, great to hear we have u on our side when it comes to discussions against non-esteghlalis...