Kia, Karimi, Hashemian, Rahman Rezai

[Doctor DOOM]

bahram jan, it is one thing to say "get used to seeing sadeghi instead of kia" or similar illogical decisions by the coach. but it is another thing to accept "THIS IS THE BEST SET OF PLAYERS WE HAVE" which usually represents a national team.
( I know u didnt say that. but the sense of a national team is that only )

then we shd NOT be surprised to see numerous criticism and complaints about the roster.
as long as it is not "THE BEST WE HAVE FOR EVERY POST", there will be criticism. others better come to terms with that, coz some of us put the TEAM higher than the INDIVIDUAL.

[KasraKhan]

Daei is purposely not inviting them. The problems Daei had when he was a player with Hashemian and Karimi have been well documented. Now that Daei is coach, he is giving them the cold shoulder.

I think Daei is a good coach, and deserves to coach TM one day, but right now, its just too early. We had to wait until this generation that Daei played with got old and retired, then brought Daei in on a fresh clean slate with no hashieh.

We all remember how poor Daei played in WCQ2006, and WC2006, a lot of people here, including myself, were outraged by his constant inclusion in the starting lineup and him playing 90 minutes without any consideration otherwise by Branko. It was like playing 10v11.

I am sure this type of forced inclusion caused a lot of problems behind the scenes in TM, as documented with Hashemian and Karimi. Now that Daei is the coach, he is in a position of power, it is time for revenge, and time to snub our best players. Its a power struggle. If Hashemian and Karimi come into camp, divisions and power shifts may occur. Karimi's biggest followers always were Kazemian and Madanchi, and Daei didnt invite them either. Kazemian I was never really sold on due to his in-consistency, but Madanchi is really needed by this team and had a great season in UAE, we really could use his speed and shots on the left wing where we are again weak

Don't forget Mobali too, who Daei is snubbing who coincedentally had a bad tackle on Daei 2-3 years ago.

Kia is a different story, Kia and Daei always had a good relationship and Kia is not one to stand up and create hashieh in the camp, so I'm sure Daei will invite Kia and use him as a RB.

As for Hashemian and Karimi, time will only tell, but I am not hopeful at all. The TM we see now is pretty much the TM we will have for WCQ2010 under Daei. And it really makes me sad as a die-hard TM fan, that the team we will field for such crucial games will not be our best available, no where close

[zzgloo]

as long as it is not "THE BEST WE HAVE FOR EVERY POST", there will be criticism. others better come to terms with that, coz some of us put the TEAM higher than the INDIVIDUAL.

I agree, we can not just say nothing, while a better player is seating out,and the worse one playing........It is not fair to the better player,it is not fair to TM.

I how ever,did not understand,what you meant by " some of us put the team higher than individual "..............

[Martin-Reza]

bahram jan, it is one thing to say "get used to seeing sadeghi instead of kia" or similar illogical decisions by the coach. but it is another thing to accept "THIS IS THE BEST SET OF PLAYERS WE HAVE" which usually represents a national team.
( I know u didnt say that. but the sense of a national team is that only )

then we shd NOT be surprised to see numerous criticism and complaints about the roster.
as long as it is not "THE BEST WE HAVE FOR EVERY POST", there will be criticism. others better come to terms with that, coz some of us put the TEAM higher than the INDIVIDUAL.

For the 100000000th time, Sadeghi is a completely different player type than Kia. Sadeghi was the lone alternative for Nekounam or Teymourian in the squad. Yes, Sadeghi can play in different roles as well, but he is not directly competing with Kia for a spot. I really don't get how people can agree with such populistic talk.

Not to mention that Kia was neither available for the last games Sadeghi was called up for, nor for the TM camps Sadeghi now was called up for.

Does nobody realize that or do people don't bother to reply? In first case I'll really be out of here.

And, as said often before as well. Not doing what Dr Doom likes is not making a coach "illogical".

[Doctor DOOM]

ok. lets start simple :
what IS sadeghi's post ?

[KasraKhan]

ok. lets start simple :
what IS sadeghi's post ?

CDM or CM

[Doctor DOOM]

By CDM I assume you mean defensive mid. correct me if I'm wrong.

and by CM you mean central midfield. which in 4-2-3-1 is the guy behind the striker. am I correct? which to me, doesnt seem like his kind of post. he isnt creative at all. neither is he an attacking midfielder.
so the only way he can be a CM is in a 4-4-2 or 3-5-2, where he plays a central role despite his lack of creativity and absent playmaking abilities. right ?

and just to clarify, his post is NOT right or left mid. right?
and unless someone wants to go really W.I.L.D. and say he's a "palymaker" ( which can be easily debated ), we can go further here.


so anyone wants to explain to me the following:
how on earth shd we justify his presence in the midfield where both ando and nekunam are already playing?
anyone wants to admit how STUPID it is to not have called players who ARE good as right mid, and try to do patch-job by using an inefficient, out of form player OUT of his position as right mid?



and while we are doing that, anyone wants to explain why we have 5 different def mids in the new 31 man roster, nekuonam, ando, sadeghi, rahmati, kazemi ? .... while there are even more vital posts that need even more attention but get only ONE player ( who incidentally doesnt even play that position in his club ) chosen for the post?

anyone wants to explain this gigantic imbalance ?

---------------------

as for def mid:
in sadeghi's club, saipa, WHO plays the def mid role next to Sharifinasab? him or rahmati?

and in case someone WILD comes along with "he's the playmaker", they might as well explain in saipa, which one is the designated playmaker, him or sharifinasab?

and in case someone wants to say he is the player behind the forward in 4-2-3-1, then they better explain his utter impotence and complete failure in the role in recent games .... while explaining where rezaei was playing as well.


====================

anyway you look at it, he does NOT belong to TM given his recent form and games.

as def mid, besides ando and nekounam , he has to compete with his own club's def mid, rahmati who's had a better from the past months, kazemi, who is a better player and zareh whose age supports the argument ( daei wants to invest in youth that's why he doesnt call up kia, karimi, rahman, VH, .... ).
btw, is Alavi also called up?
coz that makes 6 def mids !!!
ridiculous !

as offensive mid, he has absolutely no right to be even considered when we have at least 10 better players ( playmakers, attacking mids, ... ) for the job.

as right mid, the same story as above.
as left mid? dont make me laugh, plz.

anyone wants to explain why he's not only in the squad, but actually STARTS game after game while he has consistently been one of the poorest performers?

[Martin-Reza]

ok. lets start simple :
what IS sadeghi's post ?

Sadeghi: CM, DM, RM, even OM sometimes as well
Mahdavikia: RM, RB, RFW, RCM possible sometimes as well

as for def mid:
in sadeghi's club, saipa, WHO plays the def mid role next to Sharifinasab? him or rahmati?

Rahmati most of the time, but that is because Sadeghi is a midfield allrounder and can be used well elsewhere also.

and by CM you mean central midfield. which in 4-2-3-1 is the guy behind the striker. am I correct? which to me, doesnt seem like his kind of post.

Well, depends on interpretation, but I would say that is OM. There is no real CM position in a 4-2-3-1, maybe the second DM can be slightly more offensive and be considered CM, but normally this post doesn't exist there, you have 2 DMs and 1 OM.

and just to clarify, his post is NOT right or left mid. right?
and unless someone wants to go really W.I.L.D. and say he's a "palymaker" ( which can be easily debated ), we can go further here.

He can play on the right wing as well, like Teymourian can too, and even OM sometimes although he is not a typical playmaker and I prefer him in a more defensive post.

how on earth shd we justify his presence in the midfield where both ando and nekunam are already playing?

For a 4-4-2 diamond he is ideal, because, he can basically play all four positions - and in that system he can play together with Nekounam and Teymourian, like he did against Kuwait recently.

and while we are doing that, anyone wants to explain why we have 5 different def mids in the new 31 man roster, nekuonam, ando, sadeghi, rahmati, kazemi ?

He only had Sadeghi as backup for this post for the qualifiers (M. Zare was injured) so he of course now is looking for further alternatives since we usually have 2 players in that position. So Rahmati and Kazemi were called up as replacement for Nekounam and Teymourian when they are absent (WAFF etc.) and to try if they can fill the spot sufficiently.

As a short summary. Sadeghi is a reliable allrounder in midfield. He can play DM where we don't have many backups, but also can be used in almost any other position in any midfield formation wanted. He surely isn't behind players like Kazemi or Rahmati qualitywise and allows Daei to switch between different systems.

[Doctor DOOM]

1- I think we all saw how "reliable" a player he was in recent games with his disappearing acts for long whiles in the game !!!!

2- the answer to all variations of sadeghi as OM, DM, CM, .. is up there in the post. I have said he "may" be an option in saipa, although he's never the top choice for any of those posts ... but when it comes to TM, he's nowhere near the top as we have plenty of players for each of those posts that are FAR SUPERIOR to him at his best form. now, at his poor form??? there's no need to think.

3- if "testing" is what daei is trying, why in his 31 man TM roster ( not waff ) he's not called up 2-3 players for "testing" at LB?
which is already stated in other posts.

all that REEKS of double standards & bias.

[The-Red]

this is an issue that is very important and as much I also don't think that we need them or should invite them for tournaments such as the west asian games, but these 3 (Rahman's absence is not a big deal to me since as mentioned, we have players who can fill his spot and do it well) are simply crucial to this team, they still are, despite their older age compare to the rest of the team...I am just waiting to see if daie will come down from the donkey's back (az khar sheytoon paeen miyad ) and will invite the trio for the next round or not!!!...I simply would have to agree with Kasrakhan and that daie's issues in the past are the reason why he hasn't chosen them, if he does not for the next round, assuming they are not injured and have a club which all three do and are training/playing with their clubs at the moment.

daie must realize that there is a limit to his so called young team..players like sadeghi won't cut it....daie must put the team's interest befor his own ego and other issues...I guess we'll know more about that when he announces the list for the KSA game next month.

[KasraKhan]

this is an issue that is very important and as much I also don't think that we need them or should invite them for tournaments such as the west asian games, but these 3 (Rahman's absence is not a big deal to me since as mentioned, we have players who can fill his spot and do it well) are simply crucial to this team, they still are, despite their older age compare to the rest of the team...I am just waiting to see if daie will come down from the donkey's back (az khar sheytoon paeen miyad ) and will invite the trio for the next round or not!!!...I simply would have to agree with Kasrakhan and that daie's issues in the past are the reason why he hasn't chosen them, if he does not for the next round, assuming they are not injured and have a club which all three do and are training/playing with their clubs at the moment.
daie must realize that there is a limit to his so called young team..players like sadeghi won't cut it....daie must put the team's interest befor his own ego and other issues...I guess we'll know more about that when he announces the list for the KSA game next month.

Yes I agree damet garm great post. Time will tell, we are less than 2 months away from the huge clash vs KSA

[Ali Chicago]

Sorry, this is an off topic post I admit, but didn't want to open a new thread for it.

For those who live in US, there is a 3 part documentray on Discovery channel called People Republic of Capitalisem. This is a documentary by Ted Koppel about China. I know, I know, you say what the heck that has anything with football and Iranian football. Ok, it doesn't. But as I was watching last night, Koppel talked about how chineese view their government, how despite their great advances in past 4 decades, they look for creativity to west. How their favorite car is guess what it is ? A Black Buick. Lack of self beleive. I won't do justice until you see it for yourself. The part is toward the end when he talks to a Chineese guy who is a fashion photographer in China (rich and became christian), but doesnt' even dare to think about decent. It also talked about the struggle between the desire for modernity and still strong roots of traditionalisem.

All in all I saw a large number of parallels in challenges that Chineese and Iranian society face (granted in different levels and different planes).

Not trying to plug in here for Kopple or Discovery Channel here. But if you have cable, watch it. Program is 9 PM C.S.T. On Comcast Discovery is Channel 40 (at least in Mid west).

Here is the link for Koppel's page in Discovery Channel online.

http://dsc.discovery.com/convergence/koppel/koppel.html

[Martin-Reza]

1- I think we all saw how "reliable" a player he was in recent games with his disappearing acts for long whiles in the game !!!!

2- the answer to all variations of sadeghi as OM, DM, CM, .. is up there in the post. I have said he "may" be an option in saipa, although he's never the top choice for any of those posts ... but when it comes to TM, he's nowhere near the top as we have plenty of players for each of those posts that are FAR SUPERIOR to him at his best form. now, at his poor form??? there's no need to think.

3- if "testing" is what daei is trying, why in his 31 man TM roster ( not waff ) he's not called up 2-3 players for "testing" at LB?
which is already stated in other posts.

all that REEKS of double standards & bias.

1) that's debatable
2) He is top choice obviously because he's a fixed starter, we don't have better players in my eyes for DM and, very important, no player who can cover all the positions which is an important thing
3) As also already repeated numerous times, only interesting options are being tested, not players who were already ruled out long before. Also we have 2 or 3 leftback options for 1 spot, while only 3 DMs for two spot, we actually need a fourth. Come on, as if you wouldn't see the difference. Sometimes you really surprise me.

[Doctor DOOM]

^ yup.
if sadeghi being the best choice and ... *&$#$$#$# , then by the same token and logic, I shall claim I'm Jesus and I've been born on Mars, and have walked on my hands from Mars to earth, .... backward!

and as for "debatable", anything is debatable.
for example I will debate ahmadinjead a a total humanitarian who puts Mother Theresa to shame in decency.
or I can debate branko took money for inclusion of certain players.
or debate that daei has a few behind-the-scenes guys working for him in football's and IFF's coridors.
hell I can even debate ( coz in debates you are trained to speak for AND against any issue ) zareh ( or sadeghi ) has been Iran's greatest player in our history.
but does that mean it is real ?
NO.



one can take the horse to the water. but one can NOT force the horse to drink the water.
uh oh, deja vu again..... circa 2005 !!

[KasraKhan]

2) He is top choice obviously because he's a fixed starter, we don't have better players in my eyes for DM

We dont have any better for DM? Haha. How about Teymourian and Nekounam? Maybe you over-looked them?

Simply put, our midfield is our deepest asset, and to hand a starting spot to this nobody is really a shame. I cant believe you defend him like this Martin, maybe we are watching different matches, but this guy is complete trash. TRASH