My thought why the big names are not in the squad

[Martin-Reza]

I think Haji's on the right track. I think there indeed are tactical reasons as well, especially in Kia's case as two more central players currently are chosen over him.

Karimi has no club and no match praxis at all and that is a major reason for his exclusion.

[The-Red]

One could see why karimi is not invited, but Kia's exclusion is simply.....Anyways, let history be the judge, but Daie is putting his own agenda and interest over TM's interest.

[maij]

Actually it's not Majid jan. With all due respect to you aziz jan, you should remember that I am not evaluating him, I am "re-evaluating" him. So, I have a stick already measured, just checking if he is still the same old dude. Well, he was.

Oh, BTW, it was not one match, it was half a match. He only played in second half.

I was only watching Kia's move, the same Kia we knew, nothing too fancy, nothing too good or too bad. Saying that, he was playing as the right defender.

I think Daei's head is too foggy with this conspiracy issues now, he can not think strait. too much politics, or maybe there is some thing that I am not aware of. Whatever it is, it's not inside green-box related.

Cheers

Perhaps the problem lies somewhere here !

[maij]

I think Haji's on the right track. I think there indeed are tactical reasons as well, especially in Kia's case as two more central players currently are chosen over him.

Karimi has no club and no match praxis at all and that is a major reason for his exclusion.

I always thought that Kia on the wing is more productive that a defender, In fact as a defender is hovering around the average player. In Real Madrid game , he was on the wing and I though he has done a decent job , but obviously the club coach is not too satisfied with him.


I believe that Daei has many options for replacing Kia and Karimi. Hashemian , despite my own reservation of his attitude is a bit more difficult to replace as there is no aerial power in the offensive line up right now. That is why we see Aghili and Hosseini coming up the front for set pieces.

Anyway , in general , I always give the coach the benefit of the doubt on what players to selects.

[Martin-Reza]

I always thought that Kia on the wing is more productive that a defender, In fact as a defender is hovering around the average player. In Real Madrid game , he was on the wing and I though he has done a decent job , but obviously the club coach is not too satisfied with him.


I believe that Daei has many options for replacing Kia and Karimi. Hashemian , despite my own reservation of his attitude is a bit more difficult to replace as there is no aerial power in the offensive line up right now. That is why we see Aghili and Hosseini coming up the front for set pieces.

Anyway , in general , I always give the coach the benefit of the doubt on what players to selects.

Exactly, if we had some options for nokeh hamleh, Hash wouldn't be there either in his current form. That tall defenders come forward for setpieces is normal though.

One could see why karimi is not invited, but Kia's exclusion is simply.....Anyways, let history be the judge, but Daie is putting his own agenda and interest over TM's interest.

No he is not. He is simply not caring about names.

[kaz]

I think Haji's on the right track. I think there indeed are tactical reasons as well, especially in Kia's case as two more central players currently are chosen over him.

Karimi has no club and no match praxis at all and that is a major reason for his exclusion.

As opposed to the fact that half of the Saipa players being invited aren't seeing any playing minutes either. Or the fact that it's only been a few weeks in the league itself and no body has had much match practise? Or the fact that European leagues start even later?

The whole argument is non-sense. We are using different standards.

Kaabi is a started in his club, Kia is not so Kaabi is better? Rubbish. Kia is in the Bundesliga and Kaabi plays for Saipa. Do you think if Kia and Karimi came back to Iran they wouldn't light up the league?

These are poor political answers to hide the amazing amount of bias and grudge Daei and, those fans who try to become his apologists, try to hide with non-sensical answers to straight questions.

The big names are not in the squad for NON-footballing reasons. Pull your heads out of the sand.

There is some amazing amount of tripe in this thread. "Maybe it REALLY is a tactical reason". No, it's not. Kia is more tactically astute than Kaabi, Gholamnejad and Sadeghi combined. It's favouritism and one-upmanship at it's finest. "Karimi is not the same Karimi", so? He is still better than 95% of the squad. "These guys haven't done anything in a while"...and what has Mirzapour done? He was injured for 2 years and even on the bench for Estil Azin. What did Kaabi do at the AC? What has Zare EVER done?

Rubbish answers and rubbish excuses from Daei, pardon me. And, unfortunately, they are replayed by some members here who side with him yet leave these inconsistencies and even try to trivialise them. People are not dumb and that is precisely why Daei is under heat.

[Doctor DOOM]

I think there indeed are tactical reasons as well, especially in Kia's case as two more central players currently are chosen over him.

I believe that Daei has many options for replacing Kia

with due respect, these statements leave no room for me but to assume "unconditional acceptance, NO MATTER WHAT" kind of attitude.

lets examine:
1- choosing CENTRAL players for the role that is NOT CENTRAL and is along the lines ? and that makes sense ?

now, I can imagine a shuffle. where you take a player from a diff zone and try them in another ... AND THEY DELIVER THE REQUIRED DUTIES. hell, we've seen quite a few examples that such shuffles have paid dirt.
but we have ALREADY SEEN these central players' performances and if we OPEN OUR EYES we would admit none of these players have done what is required from the role or what kia delivers.

I ask you:
has any of these players delivered the quality of crosses kia does, with KIA's frequency?
has any of these players shown anything even NEAR the quality of kia's set pieces ?
does any of these players know how to cross on the run and sprint along their marks?

the answer is clear ........ for those with OPEN eyes
I fear the stress & exertion to defend each & every decision of daei's has caused us to close our eyes.


so he's kept this fellow and that fellow in kia's post. so does that automatically mean they've done the job? coz sure as hell we see they havent. this makes as much sense as me keeping mirzapoor and roudbarian in forward position. as much sense.


unless you all know something that we dont.
like a bunch of NEW NAMES that are as good right midfielders as kia.... which means somehow daei has added X and Y and Z to the roster apart from the ones we've already seen.
or
unless this so called "tactic" that we talk about is making sure the right mid displays half-arse & poor performance and effectively make our right side as weak as our left.
some "tactic", eh ?

or is this "tactic" the kind that says "f**k the width. we dont need width in the team. we'll just focus down the middle and hope abolfazl or hazrat-e abbas sends us a gift ...." so they play CENTRAL mids in the sides and DENY the team of width ? is it THIS kind of tactic you're talking about ?

ooof ooof, what a "tactic" !!! magnificent !


so it is very easy to "make" a sentence but in reality none of shojaei, sadeghi, ando or gholamnejad have been able to deliver anything NEAR kia's services on the right side.


lets not justify each and every act and word of a person, whoever he may be. no one is PERFECT.


====================

later:

having thought about that "magnificent tactic" that throws out our width, I am reminded of other aspects of football that are "thrown out" as well.

like the issue of a PLAYMAKER. we know daei has had some "magnificent" line ups where there are 3 def mids and NO playmakers. so effectively he has done away with the playmaker in his team ( never mind that the team kills itself to put an offensive move together !!! )

he has also done away with any hope of scoring off free kicks , especially the DIRECT ones ! It's like he deliberately wants to remove the existence of the term "goal from a direct kick" !!!!

so I think trying to "remove width from the team" also can be another one of such "tactics" !

[Hadi]

1, They are not doing significantly well. Neither Kia or Karimi are in their top form, Besides, Daei has good options for them particularly in a better physical shape. To name a few: Shoajei and Jabbari are more ready and Rezaei showed hungrier to fill the big shoes.
2, They will bring the authority of Daei lower than Daei likes it. What’s that? It means neither of them will sit quietly on the bench, nor the media will let it go un-noticed.
Right or wrong, I think that’s why Daei didn’t include Kia/Karimi in his squad. If the team will do OK in up-coming games, they won’t be included, if team Melli doesn’t grab the points needed in up coming 2 maybe 3 games, then he will be forced to bring them into the squad and maybe starts with them depends on the pressure of the media.
In my dream-land, I loved to have both of them as option in case we need them, but Team Melli won’t play in my dream-land.
Cheers,

I agree Haji jan completely.
from what we know of Daie, this is going to be his lineup this week:

Rahmati
Kabi-Hosseini-Aghili-Zare
Shojaie-Teymorian-Nekonam-Zandi
GR Rezaie-Hashemian

This means, Karimi and Kia are replaced by Rezaie and Shojaie (whichI have no objection to)


However, my worry is not the exclusion of Karimi and Kia.
Its the INCLUSION and probable playing of certain players like Kianoosh Rahmati, Sadeghi, Khatibi, Rafkhahi etc who are nowhere near TM levels.

[BehzadB]

lol.. if any other coach had dropped Kia, the same guys who defend Daie's decision would ask for his head...

just a point i wanted to make..

don't worry guys, we'll come to this again in a couple of years.

[maij]

Doc...let me tell you on a secret. Of course , feel free to dismiss it.

I was hoping at some stage that Daei breaks the century old tradition of Team Melli Senior players turning up and thinking that they have a divine right to be starters in the team just because they are Mr. X or Mr. Y.

Frankly , I did not think Daei had enough guts to do it and I was pleasantly surprised that he had in him. I was thinking of the trio Karimi , Hash and Kia in addition to Teymourian although the latter is not what I categorize as "bazikone Salari" but his performance was not exactly too thrilling and his benching did not auguer well.

Well...Daei has done...and perhaps exceeded my expectation.

Whether it is because of grudges that some of the members who have extreme analytic skills and power to analyze the coach's mind.

Whether it is tactical requirement

Whether it is disciplinary

Regardless....... I look at a coach who demands result from his players and selects those who can deliver. I dearly hope that those replacements "Javab Bedan" or at least do their best.

This is the only way Iran football can progress at international level. Give the field to players who are hungry , motivated and want to excel rather than players who are not that hungry , passed their prime and have very little motivation or attempts to prove themselves.

For God sake , Doc...Don't bring Zare and Sadeghi episode for me another time , I understand your views on them. In the grand scheme of things , I would give the coach such responsibility to decide on his players , despite our reservations on some of them.

It is a new and refreshing era in Iran's football..... Let us see if Daei can make an impression and if wind of change is actually beginning to flow in this very traditional society and mentality.

[Martin-Reza]

I once more sense quite big lack of tactical knowledge (or rather pretending so in order to get applouse for critisizing Daei?) in DD's last post. That players who also can fill central midfield roles (which doesn't mean they can't fill winger positions) are used as wingers is not quite the same as using players out of position.

[Martin-Reza]

As opposed to the fact that half of the Saipa players being invited aren't seeing any playing minutes either. Or the fact that it's only been a few weeks in the league itself and no body has had much match practise? Or the fact that European leagues start even later?

The whole argument is non-sense. We are using different standards.

Kaabi is a started in his club, Kia is not so Kaabi is better? Rubbish. Kia is in the Bundesliga and Kaabi plays for Saipa. Do you think if Kia and Karimi came back to Iran they wouldn't light up the league?

These are poor political answers to hide the amazing amount of bias and grudge Daei and, those fans who try to become his apologists, try to hide with non-sensical answers to straight questions.

The big names are not in the squad for NON-footballing reasons. Pull your heads out of the sand.

There is some amazing amount of tripe in this thread. "Maybe it REALLY is a tactical reason". No, it's not. Kia is more tactically astute than Kaabi, Gholamnejad and Sadeghi combined. It's favouritism and one-upmanship at it's finest. "Karimi is not the same Karimi", so? He is still better than 95% of the squad. "These guys haven't done anything in a while"...and what has Mirzapour done? He was injured for 2 years and even on the bench for Estil Azin. What did Kaabi do at the AC? What has Zare EVER done?

Rubbish answers and rubbish excuses from Daei, pardon me. And, unfortunately, they are replayed by some members here who side with him yet leave these inconsistencies and even try to trivialise them. People are not dumb and that is precisely why Daei is under heat.

Actually I was talking about tactical reasons for Kia's exclusion, I don't know why you are trying to oppose sth I didn't even bring on the table.

As for Karimi's case. He is miles past his prime while we have really good alternatives to him, he is rejected by Qatari clubs these days, has no club and therefore probably is not even in training. The first reason is the main reason for his exclusion. He, like any other players, of course has the chance to make his way back into TM by good performances on club level, since he can't deliver that at the moment, he has no chance to come back to TM - before he finds a club and shows his quality there over at least a few weeks. This is a very simply and usual thing in football, I don't get why creative theories are always needed to explain such football-basics.

[Doctor DOOM]

Doc...let me tell you on a secret. Of course , feel free to dismiss it.

I was hoping at some stage that Daei breaks the century old tradition of Team Melli Senior players turning up and thinking that they have a divine right to be starters in the team just because they are Mr. X or Mr. Y.

you see majid jan, I have already thought of this aspect and I absolutely agree.
and if you remember, I have been saying this from the days branko used to rely only on the seniors and legionnaires and not even try the young stars at IPL.
so you are preaching to the converted here.

but I also expected someone to come up with this, THAT'S WHY I BROUGHT UP THE TWO SEPARATE ASPECTS OF REPLACING A PLAYER WITH ANOTHER a few posts back.

I did say, there are 2 aspects:
1- removing player X
2- bringing in player Y

but just becoz we want to remove X doesnt mean we have the WHOLE thing covered.
is this Y worthy of this ? can he deliver the duties of this position?
( I wish you'd taken time to read my post so I dont have to repeat myself again ! ) that's why I went over the names that have been tried and what they have achieved ( ha ! big joke ) in KIA's position.

yes. lets replace the seniors or at least tell them they arent guaranteed of their place. right there behind you, I am.
but in the same breath, lets make sure when we remove a player, the replaement is AS GOOD and AS PRODUCTIVE as him.

it is THIS aspect that all of you either dont see, or deny or ignore or omit .

[Doctor DOOM]

and perhaps Mr tactical himself can explain how much sense it makes to reduce the width of the team just so the coach says "my word goes" !!

it's bloody easy to talk in general terms and quote "tactics" ! lets visit REALITY for a change and see the ACTUAL TACTICS seen in the team ... for a change, shall we ?

==================

you guys talk a lot about "generalizations and hypothesis" but not once are you ppl going to admit the players used in kia's position ARE shojaei, ando, sadeghi ... and none of them not only add to the width, but also reduce it.

dont talk to me about a GENERAL IDEA of replacing seniors and tactics and ... . we have SPECIFICS to deal with here. we have kia. we have sadeghi. we hve ando. we have shojaei.... these are SPECIFICS.

tell me which one of these guys have done what is required of a right mid ( already mentioned in many posts ).

but if you guys feel like talking in "general" terms, we will open another thread and I will agree with all the generalizations you guys come up with.

[The-Red]

Well, I noticed that many people praised nekunam today for his performance in La liga and said that he is such a great player. I was just wondering if for whatever reason Daie decides to exclude Nekunam as well in the near future, wouldn't some of the same people praising Nekunam defend Daie's action and say things such as nekunam is no longer the player he used to be, or nekunam doesn't really fit what daie has in mind or that there are players on the team can easily replace nekunam! just a thought and of course speculation and nothing else at this point.