Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

This week's bits & Pieces

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    #16
    Originally posted by maij View Post
    - None of the legionnaires impressed in the Bundesliga & the Premiership . In fact Teymourian and Kia were both benched, the former not even on the roster. Hashemian was subbed in & played but not to much effectiveness.
    In the UAE the bright side was the assists of Khatibi (3 assists) and that brilliant assist by Madanchi . Kazemian and Sanereh drew blanks.
    The only hopes remains with the Osasuna duo, Nekounam and Shojaei.

    - Today Liverpool scored what it looked like a 100% goal by Gerard , but he referee disallowed it. NOW , we are talking about the best league in the world with arguably the best referees. Let us see how Liverpool will react and how the media will call for the head of the referee and compare it to the shameful Iranian media & Perspolis action against Moradi.

    - More and more young coaches are taking the helm of their national teams. Today , Kassimov (38 years) was appointed as the coach of Uzbekistan after the disappointing results of the World Cup qualifiers. Kassimov's trail was quite similar to Daei. He coach Kourovchi for one season , won the championship and now he is the NT coach.
    How low can you go to prove a personal agenda!!?
    English fans are hooligans and even could be called at times assasins!! they have day in and out harrassed, attacked, injured and killed refs and fans across the globe what in the world are you talking about...just google search it!! what Liverpool fans will do now or not do now will not change what English fans have been! nor will it change the fact that Moradi did suck BIG TIME and persists on showing the fingers the other way..he could just come out and say I am sorry I made a mistake ...an apology goes a long way and makes the boys be different than men realizing that we all make mistakes...

    refereing in Iran as seen sucks and brings too much attention because it is indeed really horrid! nevertheless Moradi will continue to live a great life and will not lose a hair off his head!
    deerooz, emrooz, farda
    zeeremonan
    sheeshtayeea
    The only dynasty of iranian football. ( At least three back to back championships define dynasty, we had moreTeam of the people by the people for the people that fills up 100k stadium like its nothing.
    Future of true professional football if any in Iran!

    Comment


      #17
      Originally posted by Ali Chicago View Post
      Ghorbone dahanet,so we agree on relativity. Let me give you an example. Right now, Kleinsman coach of the Bayern is a very young coach, he couldn't win the WC and now is doing really bad in Bayern, recently they lost 5-2 to Verderbremen. Can I come here and say, see Kleiensman was a young and inexperienced coach and wasn't succesful in German NT or so far in Bayren, therefore Daie won't be succesful?!! I can make that deduction, but by no stretch of imagination it is a logical comparison and it merely indicated my negative bias toward Mr. Daie. Specially in light of I not being having a very positive outlook toward Mr. Daie, it may seem logical to me come up with that conclusion, but I resist that. The point is all of us have BIAS as you clearly mentioned, but we need to be aware of that BIAS and review our actions to see is it our BIAS that driving certain decisioins!

      As for the second part of your post (seeing the empty half, there is a possibility you are right of course) but I request you review my actions again. Now, have I said everything that Daie does is wrong? Wasn't I who opened the thread that even a loss in KSA isn't the end and let's not get onto Mr. Daie's case?
      There were news in Iran that Uzbakistan game was cancelled because Mr. Daie had to travel to USA for his green card or maybe citizenship. Did I try to magnfigy that and opened 100 thread (like certain members on the other side)?

      I am critical of certain actions of Mr. Daie:
      1- His approach or Media and in general toward criticisem (which I expressed without attacking him and wished and suggested he improves on it, read my post even, I said I am afraid being so emotional might hurt the team during the game when he has to make real-time decisions and when someone is so emotioanl probably wont' be in the best frame of mind to make a logical decision).
      2- His implied bias in not inviting Kia and Karimi and trying to justify it under a disguise. I think it is Mr. Daies right to invite whoever, but he should say in my opinion I don't think X is good enough for the TM. (even for this I said this is Mr. Daie's choice but I think (IMHO) isn't the right choice).
      3- The Whole Uzbakistan friendly cancellation for whatever reason it was, did I try threads and went Ay dad va beedad we lost the only chance for a decent game?
      All those friendlies that were cancelled did I try to create Hasheiyeh and negative propaganda?

      League was postponded for 10 days ( I said I wish it hadn't, specially the fact that from players who went to Kish only 4-5 played in KSA), but even in that case, did you see numerous threads from me?


      You are a moderator yourself, please look for Ala's thread during the GN era and see for yourself what that man did, that is a full fledge negative campaign if you want to see the "EMPTY HALF". What I am talking about if wasnt' about seeing the empty half, it was not seeing anything.
      If the topic is about Daei , then let me say that the notion that Daei will not make a mistake or two , or not lose a match , or will always select the right players, is certainly an erroneous or false notion.

      I hope we agree on that point and not repeat it over and over again.

      NOW...let us look about my concept of support.

      I believe that as a fan, my prime responsibility is the support of the team. I attend the matches, watch on TV , read about the team and perhaps promote the team to others. My team along with even the best in the World ( he later apologized). I have a firsthand experience about sport journalism that I will keep close to my heart, but I wish you get this chance and then come back and tell us what you think.



      **************************
      sigpic
      **************************



      Comment


        #18
        Originally posted by maij View Post
        If the topic is about Daei , then let me say that the notion that Daei will not make a mistake or two , or not lose a match , or will always select the right players, is certainly an erroneous or false notion.

        I hope we agree on that point and not repeat it over and over again.

        NOW...let us look about my concept of support.

        I believe that as a fan, my prime responsibility is the support of the team. I attend the matches, watch on TV , read about the team and perhaps promote the team to others. My team along with even the best in the World ( he later apologized). I have a firsthand experience about sport journalism that I will keep close to my heart, but I wish you get this chance and then come back and tell us what you think.
        Well, thanks for your response. I tried to list where I think there are problems, in Mr. Daie's judgment. This doesn't mean I know more than him, Mr. Daie has done a lot of things that are good (strong discipline in the TM), but I am afraid some of his shortcomings will impact TM (for example him being very emotional and being almost paranoid toward criticism). To me support is talking about these issues with a negative PR campaign (the type someone like Ala is an expert of). Guess that is where you and I differ.

        At the end I hope success for the TM and I hope I am wrong. Time will show.
        "When I see the good in you, you get motivated, feel good about yourself and that creates synergy. It creates an environment where everybody can work better together. I think in the Iranian culture it becomes very ordinary to always see the bad in each other."
        Afshin Ghotbi ( Former TM Head Coach)



        Nasser Hejazi was the Takhti of our football.
        Mohammad Panjali (Former PP and TM Captain)
        sigpic

        Comment


          #19
          I'm just curious I didnt see such vehement support for another YOUNG TM COACH !!!

          he was iranian. much like daei.
          he was a YOUNG coach. much like daei.
          he wasnt very experienced . much like daei.
          he had just won the IPL championship. much like daei.
          he was prematurely given the helm of our national team. much like daei.
          he was controversial as well as showed weaknesses in some issues. much like daei.

          but I didnt come across such staunch support when he, much like daei, was going about his business and in the process, making some mistakes here & there.

          why is that ?

          Comment


            #20
            Originally posted by maij View Post
            If the topic is about Daei , then let me say that the notion that Daei will not make a mistake or two , or not lose a match , or will always select the right players, is certainly an erroneous or false notion.

            I hope we agree on that point and not repeat it over and over again.

            NOW...let us look about my concept of support.

            I believe that as a fan, my prime responsibility is the support of the team. I attend the matches, watch on TV , read about the team and perhaps promote the team to others. My team along with even the best in the World ( he later apologized). I have a firsthand experience about sport journalism that I will keep close to my heart, but I wish you get this chance and then come back and tell us what you think.
            Good post, I think many members are misapprehending your intentions.

            Similarly, I have my own opinions about our team's tactical choices and player selections, but I'm not going to crucify the guy simply if his team arrangement and plan doesn't accord with mine.
            Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.

            Comment


              #21
              Originally posted by RaginG Inferno View Post
              Good post, I think many members are misapprehending your intentions.
              Similarly, I have my own opinions about our team's tactical choices and player selections, but I'm not going to crucify the guy simply if his team arrangement and plan doesn't accord with mine.
              Would you mind to elaborate on the term "crucify"? In F+ at least 99% of the time nobody crucifies anybody here. We discuss and criticize but crucify!!!???

              What is the alternative if we don't criticize, to stay silent when the TM head coach and act that way on the national TV?Sitting silent and supposedly "support", giving blank check and implicit approval to someone who think above everybody else and acts as a Gholdor?

              I am really surprised to see a reaction like this from you specially the term crucify!!! Football fans in Liverpool, England in general kill fans of the other team, get drunk and swear at this and that coaching staff included, Spaniard call the black player's a Monkey and skin Aragones for including certain player. I don't condone that. In comparison to those kind of behavior we merely expecting the head coach of the TM not to go on rage on the national TV for a 10 minute rant and accusing the host of ill desires for the TM is "crucification of him"?

              Expecting answering to the papers in a semi logical way to the question of why X or Y isn't included without accusing them of ill purposes is crucification?

              Questioning and discussing (not insulting him or the player) certain player's selection and inclusion in the starting lineup like Gholamnezhad who even don't start in their own team (Paas) is a crucification?

              Questioning and discussing starting Zandi every time on the left when everyone sees his level of participation in the defensive work is "Crucification"?

              Last time, I checked Crucification has a very strong connotation, don't you think you are exaggerating here?
              "When I see the good in you, you get motivated, feel good about yourself and that creates synergy. It creates an environment where everybody can work better together. I think in the Iranian culture it becomes very ordinary to always see the bad in each other."
              Afshin Ghotbi ( Former TM Head Coach)



              Nasser Hejazi was the Takhti of our football.
              Mohammad Panjali (Former PP and TM Captain)
              sigpic

              Comment


                #22
                Originally posted by RaginG Inferno View Post
                Good post, I think many members are misapprehending your intentions.

                Similarly, I have my own opinions about our team's tactical choices and player selections, but I'm not going to crucify the guy simply if his team arrangement and plan doesn't accord with mine.

                Thanks....

                Many people get obsessed with their own ability to be better than the next guy. We all have our own beliefs and ideas, nothing is wrong with that, but when it comes with dogmatic manner, it simply spoils the true spirit of discussion.



                **************************
                sigpic
                **************************



                Comment


                  #23
                  Originally posted by Ali Chicago View Post
                  Would you mind to elaborate on the term "crucify"? In F+ at least 99% of the time nobody crucifies anybody here. We discuss and criticize but crucify!!!???
                  What is the alternative if we don't criticize, to stay silent when the TM head coach and act that way on the national TV? What are we sitting silent against, giving blank check and implicit approval to Gholdor?
                  I am really surprised to see a reaction like this from you specially the term crucify!!! Football fans in Liverpool, England in general kill fans of the other team, get drunk and swear at this and that coaching staff included, Spaniard call the black player's a Monkey and skin Aragones for including certain players. I don't condone that. In comparison to those not expecting the head coach of the TM to go on rage on the national TV for a 10 minute rant and accusing the host of ill desires for the TM is "crucification of him"?
                  Expecting answering to the papers in a semi logical way to the question of why X or Y isn't included without accusing them of ill purposes is crucification?
                  Questioning and discussing (not insulting him or the player) certain player's selection and inclusion in the starting lineup like Gholamnezhad who even don't start in their own team (Paas) is a crucification?
                  Questioning and discussing starting Zandi every time on the left when everyone sees his level of participation in the defensive work is "Crucification"?
                  Last time, I checked Crucification has a very strong connotation, don't you think you are exaggerating here?
                  Ali jan, you're on a roll. Unfortunately, when people start making excuses for this kind of behaviour then you're not going to sway them with logic. This is an unnatural way of supporting.

                  Comment


                    #24
                    In F+, no one has ever critisized or advertized excessively for any body, or anything !! ( OK, May be with the exception of our dear DD about "Zare" )..

                    But, for some reason, there are some members and some staffs, who keep branding other members and discourage them from stateing thier opinion,and keep calling them 'uncivilized'etc,etc,.......It appears, these discouragements and preventaive majores have gone so much., members have begun to secound guess themseleves, and be appologetic about thier opinions !!.....

                    I , encourage my fellow F+ members, to ignore those negative voices,and continue, stateing your true opinions, without any reservations( Within moral code ! )....and be sure, only from free dialoges comes progress !!!....
                    Asking others to think differently, and not say what they have in thier mind, is always wrong !, no matter how well intentioned it may appear to be !
                    Let Ideas challenge themseleves....and stay away from people's minds,cultures and charactors !!

                    Comment


                      #25
                      ey agha !!
                      bahram jan, I did not pick on zareh , the person.

                      I pick on using zareh as left back.
                      and if I insisted on talking about him was becoz game after game he was fixed at TM< and game after game he failed more than succeed in his duties ... just to be fixed for the next game !!!
                      I talked about it becoz some ppl wanted to sweep the dirt under the rug in their zeal to put the stamp of approval on daei's record. fine with me ... as long as it is valid and makes sense.

                      in fact if anyone watched bargh's game today, which I hope some friends here had , they'd have discovered zareh does NOT play as the left back in bargh.
                      hell he doesnt even play on the left !
                      he was the RIGHT MIDFIELDER ... as he has been for years now.
                      and actually he played quite decently, I must say.
                      hell, to his credit, I've even suggested using zareh as our right midfield choice ( if daei cant get himself to put away his personal stuff aside about kia ).
                      zareh is certainly better at RM than either sadeghi or ando.

                      I do not pick on the "person" ... rather than the horrible choice of picking the wrong player for the wrong position .... which is a remnant of someone else's moronic mistake and stubbornness from years ago !!!!

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Payman jaan, pick or not pick as much as you want.....
                        It is a free country !!,and that is my whole point !!

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Originally posted by Ali Chicago View Post
                          Would you mind to elaborate on the term "crucify"? In F+ at least 99% of the time nobody crucifies anybody here. We discuss and criticize but crucify!!!???
                          What is the alternative if we don't criticize, to stay silent when the TM head coach and act that way on the national TV?Sitting silent and supposedly "support", giving blank check and implicit approval to someone who think above everybody else and acts as a Gholdor?
                          I am really surprised to see a reaction like this from you specially the term crucify!!! Football fans in Liverpool, England in general kill fans of the other team, get drunk and swear at this and that coaching staff included, Spaniard call the black player's a Monkey and skin Aragones for including certain player. I don't condone that. In comparison to those kind of behavior we merely expecting the head coach of the TM not to go on rage on the national TV for a 10 minute rant and accusing the host of ill desires for the TM is "crucification of him"?
                          Expecting answering to the papers in a semi logical way to the question of why X or Y isn't included without accusing them of ill purposes is crucification?
                          Questioning and discussing (not insulting him or the player) certain player's selection and inclusion in the starting lineup like Gholamnezhad who even don't start in their own team (Paas) is a crucification?
                          Questioning and discussing starting Zandi every time on the left when everyone sees his level of participation in the defensive work is "Crucification"?
                          Last time, I checked Crucification has a very strong connotation, don't you think you are exaggerating here?
                          Ali Agha, your whole post is based on a false premise: that my 'crucification' comment was necessarily a reference to the comments made in the Football + forum. In fact, my comments are largely directed at the general body of Iranian fans/Iranian media.


                          By the way, with respect to Daei accusing Ferdowsipour of wanting TM to fail, I wouldn't say that was such a wild accusation. Although Daei's accusation was somewhat extreme, from the information available to me, it is not what I'd term an untrue accusation. I suggest you research the issue further and make your own mind up...
                          Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Originally posted by RaginG Inferno View Post
                            Ali Agha, your whole post is based on a false premise: that my 'crucification' comment was necessarily a reference to the comments made in the Football + forum. In fact, my comments are largely directed at the general body of Iranian fans/Iranian media.
                            By the way, with respect to Daei accusing Ferdowsipour of wanting TM to fail, I wouldn't say that was such a wild accusation. Although Daei's accusation was somewhat extreme, from the information available to me, it is not what I'd term an untrue accusation. I suggest you research the issue further and make your own mind up...
                            You made a comment in an F+ thread in response to a post in F+ and used the word crucification, hence my comment. So you beleive Ferdoosipoor wants the TM fail and care to elaborate why? Because he is an enemy of Daie?

                            Well, to be honest there has been an atmosphere created that no one dares to even criticize Daie mainly due to:

                            Either Daie will blame them of being anti TM and they want TM to fail.

                            The only serious game against a decent team is cancelled by the coach with no logical reason and even contrvaersial Iranian sport papers don't peep.

                            Dai'es company in a very non-transparent way gets the contract with the TM and still nothing.

                            The way he get selected as head coach (based oh his own remarks in Navad). IFF even hadn't ask for a program from him and somehow after 20 days wihtout any furhter negotiation all of a sudden he is annouced as the head coach.

                            He stops the league for 12 days and take the team to Kish and only 5 or 6 of those players whowent to Kish play agaisnt KSA but still league is delayed.

                            Anyhow, this is getting so repetetive that once feels nausia to repeat it again and again.

                            It is not about Daiet, it is about the personality, someone who seems himself above the system. Rules and regulation means nothing to him. Out of anybody else, I am really surprised to see your implict approval. But hey it is a free country.

                            In a football that we have enough Sultan's, General, Emperror, Shahryar, the last thing we need is a connected Gholdor.
                            "When I see the good in you, you get motivated, feel good about yourself and that creates synergy. It creates an environment where everybody can work better together. I think in the Iranian culture it becomes very ordinary to always see the bad in each other."
                            Afshin Ghotbi ( Former TM Head Coach)



                            Nasser Hejazi was the Takhti of our football.
                            Mohammad Panjali (Former PP and TM Captain)
                            sigpic

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Originally posted by Ali Chicago View Post
                              You made a comment in an F+ thread in response to a post in F+ and used the word crucification, hence my comment. .
                              I can see how my comments could be interpreted in that sense; I should have been more clear.

                              Originally posted by Ali Chicago View Post
                              Either Daie will blame them of being anti TM and they want TM to fail.
                              A lot of them are Anti-TM; his accusations aren't completely unfounded, as you seem to imply. The media who consistently fabricate interviews and news surely have other interests at heart(primarily, commercial interests).

                              Secondly, I believe there was a story on the main page a few months ago(after the Iran v UAE game) detailing Ferdowsipour's role in undermining Daei.

                              Originally posted by Ali Chicago View Post
                              The only serious game against a decent team is cancelled by the coach with no logical reason and even contrvaersial Iranian sport papers don't peep.
                              Iran v Uzbekistan was cancelled due to a clash with WAFF, right? Or was it that the clubs wouldn't release their players? I didn't follow this issue too closely, I was quite busy at the time.

                              Originally posted by Ali Chicago View Post
                              The way he get selected as head coach (based oh his own remarks in Navad). IFF even hadn't ask for a program from him and somehow after 20 days wihtout any furhter negotiation all of a sudden he is annouced as the head coach.
                              I never endorsed the selection process(I don't even know of what the process consisted!).

                              Originally posted by Ali Chicago View Post
                              He stops the league for 12 days and take the team to Kish and only 5 or 6 of those players whowent to Kish play agaisnt KSA but still league is delayed.
                              Inviting players to Kish for a training camp does not necessarily place Daei under any obligation to play these invitees against KSA, if he isn't impressed.


                              Originally posted by Ali Chicago View Post
                              It is not about Daiet, it is about the personality, someone who seems himself above the system. Rules and regulation means nothing to him.
                              I do concur with you here, to some extent. He is quite argumentative, emotional and vindictive. However, I also do not view his actions in isolation; the Iranian media don't play by the rules either. In the words of Ghotbi, many of them are 'animals'.

                              However, in my opinion, one must always be respectful in expression. Daei has a worrying tendency to lose his cool which I cannot endorse, but to a small extent, his behaviour can be qualified by reference to his adversaries(I guess he sees it as fighting fire with fire).

                              Ultimately, my comments are largely concerned with TM's performances. I do appreciate that Daei has proceeded with a young squad. Of course, there are some inclusions/exclusions that I disagree with, I concur with his general philosophy.
                              Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Originally posted by RaginG Inferno View Post
                                I can see how my comments could be interpreted in that sense; I should have been more clear.
                                A lot of them are Anti-TM; his accusations aren't completely unfounded, as you seem to imply. The media who consistently fabricate interviews and news surely have other interests at heart(primarily, commercial interests).
                                Secondly, I believe there was a story on the main page a few months ago(after the Iran v UAE game) detailing Ferdowsipour's role in undermining Daei.
                                Iran v Uzbekistan was cancelled due to a clash with WAFF, right? Or was it that the clubs wouldn't release their players? I didn't follow this issue too closely, I was quite busy at the time.
                                I never endorsed the selection process(I don't even know of what the process consisted!).
                                Inviting players to Kish for a training camp does not necessarily place Daei under any obligation to play these invitees against KSA, if he isn't impressed.
                                I do concur with you here, to some extent. He is quite argumentative, emotional and vindictive. However, I also do not view his actions in isolation; the Iranian media don't play by the rules either. In the words of Ghotbi, many of them are 'animals'.
                                However, in my opinion, one must always be respectful in expression. Daei has a worrying tendency to lose his cool which I cannot endorse, but to a small extent, his behaviour can be qualified by reference to his adversaries(I guess he sees it as fighting fire with fire).
                                Ultimately, my comments are largely concerned with TM's performances. I do appreciate that Daei has proceeded with a young squad. Of course, there are some inclusions/exclusions that I disagree with, I concur with his general philosophy.
                                Well there are a lot of details, like in WAFF we played with our B team essentially and a lot can be said about Kish (although I totally agree with your comment about inviting players to Kish doesn't mean they had to play). But my comment about Kish wasnt' about why they didn't play, it was more like we all knew legioners like Zandi, Shojai, Ando, Hashemain, Nekoonam, Madanchi (6 out of 11 starters) won't be in Kish (so why postpond the league?)

                                My concerns isn't with inclusion or exclusion of X or Y. It is about the process and methodology that is being used by him. He sees himself above the system and I dont' know how but somehow he is operating above the system. Now, kudos to him for his amazing work ethic, smart, wealth, will power, etc. etc. However, in a country like Iran, these type of poeople historically have come as hero and at the end they left as something else. There are numerous historic charcters in our society. If anything is the foundation of civilization and progrees is the rule of law. Mr. Daie can be the best person in the world, but he seems to be willing/able to operate outside the so called Law (as imperfect as it is) in Iran. That is my biggest concern.

                                I hope you find more time and get a chance to follow the news from several sources and judge for yourself (rather than a limited source for example PFDC only). All Iranian newspapers are on the web, if you have the desire or the time to follow the sport news. I found you based on your posts a very fair and intelligent member of the PFDC and looking forward for more dialogue in the future.
                                "When I see the good in you, you get motivated, feel good about yourself and that creates synergy. It creates an environment where everybody can work better together. I think in the Iranian culture it becomes very ordinary to always see the bad in each other."
                                Afshin Ghotbi ( Former TM Head Coach)



                                Nasser Hejazi was the Takhti of our football.
                                Mohammad Panjali (Former PP and TM Captain)
                                sigpic

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X