What is behind Daei wanting Karimi Back ?

[zzgloo]

OK, Daei started like he knows everything, and does not need anybody !
he even, wanted to teach the league players not to go to Arab leagues !
He brought players such Sadeghi, and many other...he tried and tried....the whole league has been at his possession !!......
Now after , many mounths...and after sub-par results...and possibility of TM getting disqualified ,....and still not knowing the starters in TM.........etc,etc.
What is this Karimi Fiasco ,Now, about anyway ?....what ever happened to daei not needing any body ?...and what ever happened to his new faces takeing over old faces ?

1- Is it because he is admiting he made a mistake about karimi ?

2- Is it because he is desparate ?

3-Is it because, he wants to blame it on him ?

4- Is it because his assistants want karimi ?

5-Is it because he has been humbled by failier ?

6- is it because he has become smarter,and now is eating his words ?

7- Is it because he just found out how good Karimi is ?

8-Is it because karimi used to play bad, and now all of the sudden plays good ?

9-is it because he still does not know who to play at TM ?

10-Is it because he is told , by higher hands, he should bring karimi to TM ?

[Martin-Reza]

I am amazed you found 10 wrong reasons that easily .

I think the truth probably simply is that he always wanted Karimi in TM and therefore called him up for DPR Korea as soon as Karimi had sufficient match praxis. Karimi stepped down and both didn't talk to each other again and Daei planned without him. But now some people managed to get them to a table and make peace and now he's back.

The reason Karimi was not invited for a while was that he was testing younger players and therefore temporarily excluded several older keyplayers like Kia, Hash or Karimi and then Karimi had been recovering from a minor injury, didn't have a club and hadn't played a competitive match in months, so very rightfully he was not invited for KSA. As soon as he was playing competitive football again, he was immediately invited.

Don't forget, it wasn't Daei who sidelined Karimi, it was Karimi who sidelined Karimi after being invited - and that rather classless: Daei got to know over the press. I understand that Daei then was finished with him and am a bit surprised he is willing to forgive him, especially after a few months already.

Daei never made a mistake in this, the only mistake was not to talk with Karimi enough before KSA and DPR and maybe now that he is taking him back, we'll see.

I think the situation is quite clear, but am a bit amazed that you seemingly try to make Daei look bad no matter what with this. You talk as if Daei claimed Karimi wouldn't be good enough for TM at any time and threw him out of TM. What should he have done after Karimi publicly announced his retirement from TM after being invited? Force him to play for Iran, sue him?

[Doctor DOOM]

OK, Daei started like he knows everything, and does not need anybody !
he even, wanted to teach the league players not to go to Arab leagues !
He brought players such Sadeghi, and many other...he tried and tried....the whole league has been at his possession !!......
Now after , many mounths...and after sub-par results...and possibility of TM getting disqualified ,....and still not knowing the starters in TM.........etc,etc.
What is this Karimi Fiasco ,Now, about anyway ?....what ever happened to daei not needing any body ?...and what ever happened to his new faces takeing over old faces ?
1- Is it because he is admiting he made a mistake about karimi ?
2- Is it because he is desparate ?
3-Is it because, he wants to blame it on him ?
4- Is it because his assistants want karimi ?
5-Is it because he has been humbled by failier ?
6- is it because he has become smarter,and now is eating his words ?
7- Is it because he just found out how good Karimi is ?
8-Is it because karimi used to play bad, and now all of the sudden plays good ?
9-is it because he still does not know who to play at TM ?
10-Is it because he is told , by higher hands, he should bring karimi to TM ?

1- bahram jan, my friend, there's nothing wrong when someone tries to make up for a mistake.
in fact we shd applaud any person who tries to rectify an error. why persecute him further? I think it takes a big man to admit to a mistake and then go about correcting it and I certainly admire this in anyone.

2- secondly, I dont see the return of karimi as any "fiasco". why? has there been any trouble that I dont know about?

3- we ALL are desperate and not only ali daei. TM is in a desperate situation and we're all in it.

4- I dont see ( or hear ) any assistant who wants karimi. It's a natural matter of having an experienced and skillful star who can help the team at a time that the team needs help in his post.

5- I dont think daei has "failed" per se. he's had bumps and problems all along with some mistakes and errors. but overall we havent failed yet.

6- why cant we just limit it to "he's become smarter" and leave out the unnecessary "eating his words" ?

7- I think we all knew what karimi could bring to the table , daei included.

8- that happens to every single player who can have good as well as bad periods.

9- you may be right on this one. with a wink at bagheri's situation

10- I sincerely hope that is NOT the case. for the sake of TM, our football .

[Mr.Good]

As Martin-Reza said Daei was at no fault.

Karimi was out of shape at the beginning of the Qualifier. everybody saw his first few games with PP and how out of breth he was after the hour mark. As soon as Karimi got back into match form, Daei did invite him, but it was karimi that refused. Karimi is just a spoiled child and Daei was not ready to go smooth talk him. Now it seems that a third party did the initial talking and Karimi is back. He is also Match fit, well according to IPL standard of course.

[zzgloo]

I am amazed you found 10 wrong reasons that easily .

I think the truth probably simply is that he always wanted Karimi in TM and therefore called him up for DPR Korea as soon as Karimi had sufficient match praxis. Karimi stepped down and both didn't talk to each other again and Daei planned without him. But now some people managed to get them to a table and make peace and now he's back.

The reason Karimi was not invited for a while was that he was testing younger players and therefore temporarily excluded several older keyplayers like Kia, Hash or Karimi and then Karimi had been recovering from a minor injury, didn't have a club and hadn't played a competitive match in months, so very rightfully he was not invited for KSA. As soon as he was playing competitive football again, he was immediately invited.

Don't forget, it wasn't Daei who sidelined Karimi, it was Karimi who sidelined Karimi after being invited - and that rather classless: Daei got to know over the press. I understand that Daei then was finished with him and am a bit surprised he is willing to forgive him, especially after a few months already.

Daei never made a mistake in this, the only mistake was not to talk with Karimi enough before KSA and DPR and maybe now that he is taking him back, we'll see.

I think the situation is quite clear, but am a bit amazed that you seemingly try to make Daei look bad no matter what with this. You talk as if Daei claimed Karimi wouldn't be good enough for TM at any time and threw him out of TM. What should he have done after Karimi publicly announced his retirement from TM after being invited? Force him to play for Iran, sue him?

Martin Jaan........And Payman e aziz......I am not a " Bad Khah "....and I have no hidden agenda.....
My true and honest opinion, Is that, Ali Daei's project of creating " A new generation " has failed !....thats all I believe....
The Goal keeping is the only Improvement we can point to.....but;
center defense ?
Corners ?
midfield,with this rovolving door ?
Forwards ?
Strategies ?
I believe,he is now, pushing the panik bottom..and is desparate for some additional action, since he does not see his changes to TM be enough to take us to the next level !
.....
South korea, about two years ago went through this " Whole sale changes ", and " new Generation " period.....but the difference was that they had a c oach who could teach, and bring out the hidden talents,and nurtured young prospects....with Daei, he only thinks, trying new faces, will solve the problem without actualy giveing them any assignments ,or adding to thier knowledge of football.....that,is not enough to create a new generation !..it is just a cosmetic change .
I love TM, and very much try to be positive and look at the full half of the glass.......But, Daei's potentials have reached its end, in my opinion.....and we are just limping toward the WC .

[BehzadB]

unity and fan support. IMO,That's the main reason.

Karimi's football skills don't hurt either..
I mean when you have Bagheri as your starting midfield, how bad can Karimi be?

[faraz]

am i the only one who thinks daei's call up may actually be due to on-pitch reasons?

let's face it, it doesn't get more creative than Karimi for us. we need a creative presence like that on the field and his name will also be a source of fear to the many defenders he's rounded in the past.

I give credit to daei for stepping out of his element.

now only if he has the guts to bench Bagheri...

[Martin-Reza]

Martin Jaan........And Payman e aziz......I am not a " Bad Khah "....and I have no hidden agenda.....
My true and honest opinion, Is that, Ali Daei's project of creating " A new generation " has failed !....thats all I believe....
The Goal keeping is the only Improvement we can point to.....but;
center defense ?
Corners ?
midfield,with this rovolving door ?
Forwards ?
Strategies ?
I believe,he is now, pushing the panik bottom..and is desparate for some additional action, since he does not see his changes to TM be enough to take us to the next level !
.....
South korea, about two years ago went through this " Whole sale changes ", and " new Generation " period.....but the difference was that they had a c oach who could teach, and bring out the hidden talents,and nurtured young prospects....with Daei, he only thinks, trying new faces, will solve the problem without actualy giveing them any assignments ,or adding to thier knowledge of football.....that,is not enough to create a new generation !..it is just a cosmetic change .
I love TM, and very much try to be positive and look at the full half of the glass.......But, Daei's potentials have reached its end, in my opinion.....and we are just limping toward the WC .

Well, he always made his team look younger than it really was. I basically don't think it's a bad idea to have a time when you simply throw younger or less experienced new faces into the cold water (like Gholamnejad or Ashjari) and then, just keep the very best of them with now better experience and combine them with good veterans.

You are correct, this is not quite creating a new generation, but it's healthy for the team. I don't know if Daei ever claimed he would aim a complete break or if that was what we assumed after some veterans were temporarily (while we thought permanently) excluded.

[Doctor DOOM]

Bahram jan, nobody questions your love for TM as well as good intentions.
(if they do, send them to me. I'll take care of them )

The thing is by throwing something in the face of someone who has had a turn-around and has accepted his mistakes, we're not going to get anything. and in fact, that person may buck & rear and may become obstinate again.

I think , speaking for myself, I'm taking Daei's move on karimi as good faith and applaud his courage. afterall it is a move for the betterment of TM. I would definitely criticize any move that may be against TM's benefit.

---------------

and as I said, we ARE in a near state of panic and in a desperate situation.
no thanks to the dropped points in uae and azadi.
It is natural for most coaches to resort to slightly ... lets say "un-usual" moves to get the job done ("unusual" in the way that had it been normal circumstances, they wouldnt have done the same).


----------------

I also think we have had some good prospects brought in to TM camp.
I may not agree with the way we use them, but certainly will not deny introduction of the likes of khalatbari, g-nejad, rezaei, ashjari, meydavoodi, salehi, .... . some of whom may not have seen the gates of TM camp had it been some other "people" in charge ... still

"HOW" he uses these ppl is a different matter. But I'm glad he's brought them in.
I sincerely detect hints of favoritism in his line ups and selections. and THAT, I have problems with.

==============

on the matter of tactics and strategy, I'm totally with you.
I think given the amount of time he's had, we shd have seen some style or overall team strategy in TM. but so far the most common things I've seen at TM are lobbing of the balls from defense and repeated ( and mostly useless ) pass-backs !!!

[zzgloo]

1-Daei Has shown,he has nothing to offer when it comes to strategies or game planning .

2-Daei ,by zig-zag ing, massive invitations ,and back and forth ,with new and old players,and still haveing no fix TM players..shown he does not know what he is doing. he keeps inviting players ,both because ,thats all he knows,as well as keep us fans hopeful and guessing !

3-Daei's result speak the same.....and may be he has been a little on the lucky side as well......we realy had not have a game where we deserved more than the result we got...but we have had the other way around.

4-His new generation TM has not been materialized,and that is his fault only, as he has been given all resources, as well as all our benefit of the doubt and well wishing.
......................

Based on what indication, we should hope for a better future ?

[Doctor DOOM]

I think we're pretty certain a large portion of the starting 11 are known by now.

-----------------Rahmati-------------------
kaabi---------aghili---------hosseini-----ashjari
-----------------nekounam--------------------


I think everyone agrees with the above players and Daei seems set on them ... for good reasons too.
so we've come to a sort of stability in our defensive line up.
apart from rezaei as one of the strikers, it is the attacking personnel that we're having difficulty finding good players.
that makes 7 out of 11.

daei is trying real hard to force shojaei-khalatbari as TM flanks. but as they under-perform in each game, he is not able to make a case for & justify his selection.

also his OM/playmaker/CM/whateveryouwanttocallit choices have been usually poor. so we need to change the above 3 choices.

narrowing it down, I guess the instability is about the midfield's right, left and central players + the second striker.

once we get these 4 posts correctly, we're all set.
=================

then, we have the matter of team tactics and strategy and other nitty gritty stuff.

I think Daei's slowly finding out this is not as easy as it seemed a year ago!

[zzgloo]

-----------------Rahmati-------------------
kaabi---------aghili---------hosseini-----ashjari
-----------------nekounam--------------------

Are you sure about ( Aghili......Hosseini ) ?......Are they what makes us " Set " for that possition ?........Do you see them atleast as good as ( Golmohammadi......Rahman ) ?

Has ashjari done enough to not worry about the left corner ? or he is just the best we could come up with ?

Take the nekunam out ! ( the Branko's choice ) , how do you see our midfiled ?

With ,near future,VH retirement,how do you see our forwards ?

[Doctor DOOM]

None of them are ideal ( except rahmati, of course ). but you'd asked about "stability" and I brought up those names that ahve been used frequently and it seems daei's fixed those positions with those guys.

but if you insist, bro, lets talk about golmo and rahman.
isnt it the same golmo who used to be slow as a snail and in many games was the weak point of our defense? didnt he cause a totally unwanted penalty in WC and miss a few more himself ?
so it's not as if golmo was anything close to ideal.

now, rahman. wasnt he at fault for one of mexico's goals? or the one against china in AC07 or ... quite a few other instances where he's come up pretty short.

ashjari.
I think proving his case is one of the easiest. look at the other players we;ve tried in the past 4-5 years. that shd answer you.

even if we take out nekounam, with kazemi doing well, zareh doing adequately and ando getting back in shape, I'd say we dont have too much to worry if it happens.

the midfield and strikers are where he needs to find good players and place them correctly.

[The-Red]

i said this in the general football forum and say it again,,,,IMO, and feel free to disagree, IFF and Daie both need Karimi and the big names to be able to later and in case the team doesn't qualify shield themselves to an extent...Branko and the IFF called back Hashemian and even Azizi when the team was in trouble in 2004...anyways, it's all good as long as it works out for TM>...I don't much care for the motive behind it...

[Ali Chicago]

unity and fan support. IMO,That's the main reason.
Karimi's football skills don't hurt either..
I mean when you have Bagheri as your starting midfield, how bad can Karimi be?

Kam gooyo and gozideh gooy chood dour. Says it all. I am afraid even with the so called legioners we still will be in trouble. Hope i am wrong.