Mark Your Man !!!!!

[Doctor DOOM]

I'm watching the PP game and they, much like sepahan, conceded a goal due to abysmal marking in our box!

In fact this poor marking has resulted in the BULK of goals conceded by our clubs and TM in int'l stage!

our def mids have a large portion of the blame in this, but our defenders arent bereft of it either!

I can imagine marking your man 100% of the time may be asking for too much. but on corners and set pieces too? that's just criminal neglect and dumb football !

till when are we to witness these silly mistakes that can easily be rectified?

[yashar_fasihnia]

these performances by our clubs in ACL and our TM under different coaches are just signs of how our football is being destroyed and how 2nd rated and 3rd rated asian teams are catching up with us....
no matter who the coach was, european, iranian, offensive, defensive, ex- european legionaire, and no matter wat squad we use and wat formation we use and how offensive of defensive we play, its always more or less ending the same way... this is not coincidence at all, not under every coach and against every possible team from west asia, east asia, central asia, club or national team...

perspolis today was a good indication of iranian football - miserable defense, impotent and uncreative forward line! and when neither of them are working well, it becomes a catastrophe!

[Doctor DOOM]

I dont want to open a whole new thread on this, but I just HAVE TO say this:
what a performance by Karimi.... despite being marked closely by the ghataris.

The guy was literally a one-man-team!
yes, he has lost a bit of step and he is getting on. But today, he showed inspite of all this, he IS a class or two above all the rest we have in Iran.

what encourages me is that he WAS indeed well marked for the game ( the opponents did their homework on him ) and still he managed to give so many passes and score a goal and cause so much trouble ( that is Tourre or niki were a bit more intelligent , they'd have scored 2-3 ).

mashalah karimi.

[Martin-Reza]

I only watched until 4-0, then I switched away. Up until then, Karimi was one of the best PP players, but surely not nearly as good as you put it here. His contribution in the attacking third was not satsfactory.

Still he probably was one of the, if not the, best in a dismal team.

He should do less dribbling in midfield and more decisive stuff upfront. Also he really tends to hold on to the ball too long sometimes. I think his biggest problem is dynamic in the moment. He really doesn't look anything close to explosive and pacey.

I can't see why he should be the saviour. He still could be useful for TM, at least as a sub - in case he brings the right attitude.

[faraz]

now here's the thing, i don't know whether to blame the coach for not giving the directive, or blame the players for not following the directive given by the coach.

it's simple.

Akram, Clemerson and that other Brazilian are the playmakers and key men. Why not, as soon as one of them receives the ball, call a winger/defensive mid/closest man to quickly close on them (having 2 players do that would be even better)?

Look at the way the opposing coach tried to shut down Karimi! he was closed down almost instantly and still managed to nab a goal and play a good game (this, rest assured, is b/c he's simply more talented than those marking him...).

i also love how they exposed PP right side constantly.

na kheir...we did not do our homework, and they did. simple as that.

[faraz]

I can't see why he should be the saviour. He still could be useful for TM, at least as a sub - in case he brings the right attitude.

I don't know about saviour...but there should be little doubt that he can fill the playmaking void...him, khalatbari and shojaei should make our 3 mids behind our 1 forward, with neko holding.

just my opinion.

[Martin-Reza]

I don't know about saviour...but there should be little doubt that he can fill the playmaking void...him, khalatbari and shojaei should make our 3 mids behind our 1 forward, with neko holding.
just my opinion.

Well, as DD repeatedly correctly pointed out, all three of them are probably strongest in center. So I would prefer at least one real winger alongside two of them. And in that case I would bench Karimi. For me he currently unfortunately simply is a less dynamic Shojaei. He is not quite a classic playmaker either, he is better with the ball glued to his foot than with passing the ball.

But I wouldn't mind seeing all three of them starting alongside each other neither.

I just don't agree with the immensely positive reviews about almost every game of Karimi.

[faraz]

^^yes, DD would say that...lol

i would still play khalatbari on the left, shojaei on the right, and karimi in the middle, close to our forwards. what else could potentially happen is moving karimi to the middle, khalatbari to the right, ma'adanchi on the left, with shojaei as our striker, as he's proven he can play that position in osasuna (god bless camacho). though he's not much of a target man, more of a supporting striker, it could still be tried, with karimi moving further up to support. shojaei mb could be switch with karimi in the forward position, i don't know...it's a complicated task, that's for sure. all i know is that neither hash or rezaei or khalili or nikbakht or...deserve to start as striker.

[Martin-Reza]

I am not sure if Karimi can play high tempo for 90 mins. I would prefer him as second half sub, if necessary. Either to create trouble with his dribblings, or as experienced player able to hold on to the ball, calm things down and maybe launch a few counters with throughballs.

If he starts, he must most probably be taken out after 60-70 mins against better opposition. I wouldn't start with a certain sub on the field.

Also I think Karimi will be more useful against UAE than against the fast Koreans.

[Doctor DOOM]

1- a karimi for 60 minutes can wreak havoc and enough damage in NKorea

his sub could be shojaei who can deliver his goods too.


2- but hang onto ur horses fellows, lets not get ahead of ourselves.
shojaie as a striker?
based on what?
a goal or another tap-in?
that's it?
whatever happened to "consistency"??

I know ppl are highly excited with recent surge in shojaei's form. so am I, but we shdnt lose sight of the big picture.

shojaei is NOT a striker.
he is NOT a regular goal scorer.
He has shown not to have the right temprament and technique for SCORING goals. ( he has the technique for dribbling or passing or whatever. but goal scoring needs something else )

so using shojaei as a striker is just wasting a spot in TM based on very little evidence and speculation that shojaei can score goals.
I say nay. I'd rather have someone who is USED TO goal scoring. at least far more than scoring one or two in a season. otherwise, whom shd we keep out? I assume you all want the second striker, meaning either borhani or khalili or rezaei or niki or ... !

na agha jan, shojaei is in Karimi's spot. and right now, Karimi helps the TEAM far more than shojaei. yes, I dare say this even when shojaei's scored a goal in la liga.

[Martin-Reza]

Starting Karimi and benching Shojaei is very courageous...but positively. Others might call it mad .

I think Shojaei as striker isn't such a bad idea. Not because he's such a goalgetter (and he scored three goals, not one), but because he successfully plays nokeh hamle for Osasuna sometimes. He creates danger and makes space for the second striker - who hopefully is a better scorer than Shojaei (Pandiani in Osasuna's case). Maybe that would help eg. Hashemian? Maybe worth a try. But surely a bit experimental.

[Doctor DOOM]

"Noke hamleh" ???
where? in osasuna?
then pandiani is a carrot growing in the middle of the pitch

jokes aside, shojaei isnt a goal scorer no matter he's scored 1 or 2 or 3.
he is KNOWN to be such a player. he's never scored many goals. that IS a fact.

[Martin-Reza]

^ Yeah, I didn't disagree on that obviously.

But indeed Camacho played Shojaei in front of Pandiani for the first time against Numancia and bang, Shojaei scored. Already ahead of the game this was announced and I didn't believe my eyes, but it happened and it worked.

I don't think it is the solution for our striking problems, but something a good coach successfully tried and an interesting alternative.

[Martin-Reza]

Here, look at the lineup for Atletico for example. 4-2-3-1 with Shojaei noke hamle: http://www.navarrasport.com/2009/04/05/a-lo-grande/

[faraz]

i wasn't even referring to his goal scoring ability dd jan. (even though if we consider the goal scoring record of one, vahid hashemian, we see he's even worse that shojaei).

the last 3 consecutive osasuna games, shojaei has proved his worth as a forward, irrespective of his goals. he gave a couple of important assists, got the man of the match, and seemed a lot more comfortable than in the middle or on the wing.

and btw - i don't know if you saw nikbakht play today, but i hope you agree with me in that he was absolutely dreadful in everything he did. as good as karimi was, nikbakht was on the other side, and all of his teammates were frustrated with his effort.

i don't see how you can possibly voice your approval for him. i've seen all of PP games in the ACL, and although he's had a couple of bright moments, he lacks the consistency we need.

i suppose the 'we don't have better' argument might come up, but i disagree with that too, and again, wouldn't mind seeing shojaei up front with another out and out striker.