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Is Traxtor Shazi,used as Sepretist movement ??

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    Is Traxtor Shazi,used as Sepretist movement ??

    In the hope for a more mature,sabstantive discussion on a very important issue ::here in F +

    1- We all heard the video,chants of " Arabian Gulf "..from traxtor sazi fans...

    2- The thread related to this issue was stoped by our MODS, ( Correctly so )!Teraktor fans chanting 'Arabic Gulf' in Azadi ( 1 2 3 4 5)
    Hadi

    3-Is there anything seriouse to this issue ?

    .................................................. ..................................................

    Here is the article,by proffessor Kaveh farokh :

    Complete Article : http://www.kavehfarrokh.com/news/ant...gulf%e2%80%9d/www.Kavehfarrokh.com on Friday, Aug 27, 2010 by Tara Farhid-Gallo. In the video below, pan-Turk activists:

    Chant separatist sentiments for Azarbaijan.
    Then in an interesting twist they adopt pan-Arabist rhetoric, using the historically false name of “Arab Gulf” to erroneously refer to the historically-attested Persian Gulf.
    They also flash the pan-Turk fascist salute and then howl like wolves in accordance with their philosophy of hailing from a mythical mythical Grey Wolf ancestor.


    The above video is also startling in that nearly all of the activists are youths and young adults.

    The fact that pan-Turk activists are so brazen at this time should come as no suprise to readers.

    1) The dangers of pan-Turkism were warned as early as 1989 by Dr. Jala Matini in the Iranshenasi Journal as early as 1989:

    Matini, J. (1989). Azerbaijan Koja Ast? [Where is Azerbaijan?]. Iranshenasi: A Journal of Iranian Studies, I (3), p.443-462.

    2) Western scholarship also produced a book that outlined the dangers of pan-Turkism for Iran in 2004:

    Olson, R. (2004). Turkey-Iran Relations, 1979-2004: Revolution, Ideology, War, Coups and Geopolitics. Costa Mesa, California: Costa Mesa.

    3) The writer of this posting prodced an illustrated on-line book in 2005, again outling the dangers of pan-Turkism to Iran:

    Pan-Turkism takes Aim at Azarbaijan: A Geopolitical Agenda (posted also ed at UN Association in Geneva- see also Citations of book also made in academic venues).

    Much of the activities of pan-Turk racialists have been tracked and documented for reference by www.kavehfarrokh.com. For references to all information on the subject, readers are invited to consult this link:

    Pan-Turkism or Pan-Altaism

    Below are two examples of vandalism conducted by pan-Turk activists:



    Pan-Turk activists engaging in book burnings of texts related to Cyrus the Great on December 19 2006. The photo was originally posted on pan-Turkist website www.baybak.com, subsequently reported by Payman Pakmehr of Tabriz News. The photo was then withdrawn by the www.baybek.com website.



    Destruction of Achaemenid relief by anti-Cyrus vandals at Persepolis, December 6, 2006. Note that this was just 13 days before the book burnings by pan-Turks in Tabriz on December 19, 2006 (Report on December 23, 2006 by Maryam Tabeshian of CHN; and reported by Payvand news of iran).

    Pan-Turkim is not some crude movement orchestrated by street thugs and boors. This is supported by certain parties motivated by economic-political interests. The plan was first unveiled in 1979 – a scheme known today as the “Bernard Lewis Plan:



    A map of the Bernard Lewis Proposal (source: De Hoyos, L. (1985). Derivative Assassination: Who Killed Indira Ghandi? New York: New Benjamin Franklin House). Note how Iran is now renamed as “Persia” or “Iranistan”. This was first unveiled in 1979.

    There are clear references to this plan by Western scholars:

    As noted by Engdahl (2004, p.171), the Bernard Lewis proposes that the west

    “…encourage autonomous groups such as the Kurds…Ethiopian Copts… Azerbaijanis…” Engdahl, W. (2004). A Century of War: Anglo-American Oil Politics and the New World Order. London: Pluto Press.

    Dreyfus and LeMarc (1980, p. 157-158) provide a very succinct summary of the plan’s methodology:

    “According to Lewis, the British should encourage rebellions for national autonomy by the minorities such as the Lebanese Druze, Baluchis, Azerbaiajni Turks, Syrian Alawites, the Copts of Ethiopia, Sudanese mystical sects, Arabian tribes…the goal is the break-up of the Middle East into a mosaic of competing ministates and the weakening of the sovereignty of existing republics and kingdoms…spark a series of breakaway movements by Iran’s Kurds, Azeris, baluchis, and Arabs…these independence movements, in turn would represent dire threats to Turkey, Iraq, Pakistan and other neighbouring states.” [Dreyfus and LeMarc, Hostage. 1980, p.157-158. New York: New Benjamin Franklin House Publishing Company.]

    Readers are also referred to:

    Creating an “Arc of Crisis”: The Destabilization of the Middle East and Central Asia The Mumbai Attacks and the “Strategy of Tension” – by Andrew Gavin Marshall

    In addition, the Bernard Lewis Plan has been “fine tuned” in recent years by Ralph Peters. The map below was published in an article entitled “Blood Borders: How a better Middle East would Look” which appeared in the June 2006 issue of the US Armed Forces Journal.



    A revised map of Iran and the Middle East as proposed by Ralph Peters. Note that Iran’s access to the Persian Gulf is shortened, Iranian Azarbaijan has been absorbed into the Republic of Azarbaijan, Iranian Kurdistan taken into a Greater Kurdistan with Iranian Baluchistan merged into Pakistan’s Baluchistan.

    Despite numerous references to the contrary, Professor Bernard Lewis denies that he has originated the plan to Balkanize Iran, Turkey and other countries in Western Asia.



    Professor Bernard Lewis. An expert of the entire Islamic World as well as ancient Iran. He categorically denies having any connection with plans to Balkanize Western Asia.

    This entry was posted on Sunday, August 29th, 2010 at 4:15 pm and is filed under News. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. Both comments and pings are currently closed.
    Last edited by zzgloo; 09-25-2010, 01:00 PM.

    #2
    here are two other maps, related to the previouse post :
    Last edited by zzgloo; 09-25-2010, 01:00 PM.

    Comment


      #3
      Years of neglect by the central goverments (both Pahlavi and IRI) in trampleing the legitimate basic rights of national and religious minorities in Iran is catching up with us. These aspiration being flamed by Pan Turks and Teraktorsazi games is just simply a venue for people to express themselves. Root cause is somewhere else. Democracy for the whoel Iran and respecting the basic human rights for all Iranian, plus recognizing and granting certain level of self government (the ways states in the US for example have self government or federal government in Europe) for national minorities. Same goes for trampling of the rights of religious minorities especially the human rights violation against Bahais (in particular). It is truley a shame.
      "When I see the good in you, you get motivated, feel good about yourself and that creates synergy. It creates an environment where everybody can work better together. I think in the Iranian culture it becomes very ordinary to always see the bad in each other."
      Afshin Ghotbi ( Former TM Head Coach)



      Nasser Hejazi was the Takhti of our football.
      Mohammad Panjali (Former PP and TM Captain)
      sigpic

      Comment


        #4
        well I am Azari, and all Azaris on this board can confirm that those ppl with those solgans were NOT Azaris!!!
        I am starting to believe a conspiracy here... smiliar what they are trying to do with southern Iranian football clubs slowly.

        IFF and Traktor club should invesitigate their stadiums and should carry the responsibility for this nonesence!

        please read this article:

        http://www.iranchamber.com/people/ar...an_turkism.php


        Originally posted by zzgloo View Post
        We all heard the video,chants of " Arabian Gulf "..from traxtor sazi fans...

        .
        zz jan
        these were not traktor fans BUT Pan Turkish ppl ex Turkey in the name of Traktor fans!


        Originally posted by Ali Chicago View Post
        Years of neglect by the central goverments (both Pahlavi and IRI) in trampleing the legitimate basic rights of national and religious minorities in Iran is catching up with us. These aspiration being flamed by Pan Turks and Teraktorsazi games is just simply a venue for people to express themselves. Root cause is somewhere else. Democracy for the whoel Iran and respecting the basic human rights for all Iranian, plus recognizing and granting certain level of self government (the ways states in the US for example have self government or federal government in Europe) for national minorities. .

        Ali Jan, sorry but again No AZARI wants to be separated from Iran or a separate govt. I am Azari and have planty of Azari freinds... so I know what I talk about.
        This all thing is done by outsiders IN THE NAME OF Azaris BUT NOT by Azaris themselves.!

        over the past years we have banned abt. 3 members who even joined PFDC and were publishing theri propaganda... they got perm banned from here... we have to look at the broader picture....there is a conspiracy that does not want a united Iran, we have to be more careful and NOT FALL for their tricks...

        at least trust the words of an Azari (as myself) here!!!
        CHECK OUT OUR FORUM RULES HERE: http://www.persianfootball.com/forums/faq.php




        Don't Select Players That Suit Your Tactics; Select A Tactic That Suits Your Players !!!

        Comment


          #5
          You probably get this sort of propaganda in every border city in Iran. When I lived in Ahvaz in the late 1980s / early 1990s in high school there were Arab kids who starkly supported Iran entering the desert storm in support of Iraq and against the US led coalition. I still remember Rafsanjani at that time was president. He came out on media and said this war is none of our business.
          sigpic

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Footbal...he_Asian_Games

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Ali Chicago View Post
            Years of neglect by the central goverments (both Pahlavi and IRI) in trampleing the legitimate basic rights of national and religious minorities in Iran is catching up with us. These aspiration being flamed by Pan Turks and Teraktorsazi games is just simply a venue for people to express themselves. Root cause is somewhere else. Democracy for the whoel Iran and respecting the basic human rights for all Iranian, plus recognizing and granting certain level of self government (the ways states in the US for example have self government or federal government in Europe) for national minorities. Same goes for trampling of the rights of religious minorities especially the human rights violation against Bahais (in particular). It is truley a shame.
            Very true Ali jaan.....as you said, the root cause is some where els....
            How ever, there are two issues here..
            1- The legitimate grivences by the pan-turks.
            2- If this grivences are being used by ( either islamic republic, or Republic of Azarbayjan, or even some western countries ).
            .................................................. ...............
            The patience of Azaris have limits.......untill when they can contribute so much, and be called " Turk e Khar " at the end ?
            .................................................. ..............

            here is part of bigger poem by shahriar , I just remembered :
            .................................................. .................

            Ella Ay daavar e daana.....

            To Midaani ke Irani, che mehnat ha keshid az dast e in tehran o Tehrani

            Be Rashiti Kale maahi khor,...Isfahaani ra batar Gofti

            javanaan e paak e azarbayjan ra,....Turk e khar Gofti

            Ella tehraanian ensaaf mikon,.....Khar toyee , yaa man ?

            SHAHRIAR

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by Adesor Vafaseya View Post
              well I am Azari, and all Azaris on this board can confirm that those ppl with those solgans were NOT Azaris!!!
              I am starting to believe a conspiracy here... smiliar what they are trying to do with southern Iranian football clubs slowly.
              IFF and Traktor club should invesitigate their stadiums and should carry the responsibility for this nonesence!
              please read this article:
              http://www.iranchamber.com/people/ar...an_turkism.php
              zz jan
              these were not traktor fans BUT Pan Turkish ppl ex Turkey in the name of Traktor fans!
              Ali Jan, sorry but again No AZARI wants to be separated from Iran or a separate govt. I am Azari and have planty of Azari freinds... so I know what I talk about.
              This all thing is done by outsiders IN THE NAME OF Azaris BUT NOT by Azaris themselves.!
              over the past years we have banned abt. 3 members who even joined PFDC and were publishing theri propaganda... they got perm banned from here... we have to look at the broader picture....there is a conspiracy that does not want a united Iran, we have to be more careful and NOT FALL for their tricks...
              at least trust the words of an Azari (as myself) here!!!
              God Bless You.....
              I am half azari Myself.....My father is from Mianeh.........
              I also know, All Azaries are true Iranians...yet, please read me post to Ali, and notice......there may be some other hands in this ....
              For example...it has always been a strategy of islamic Republic, to change the subject and distract people from main issues,in times of crisis.... bY " Bohraan Saazi "......
              Azaries may be plaied with...and they should be careful.
              Last edited by zzgloo; 09-01-2010, 07:13 AM.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Adesor Vafaseya View Post
                well I am Azari, and all Azaris on this board can confirm that those ppl with those solgans were NOT Azaris!!!
                I am starting to believe a conspiracy here... smiliar what they are trying to do with southern Iranian football clubs slowly.
                IFF and Traktor club should invesitigate their stadiums and should carry the responsibility for this nonesence!
                please read this article:
                http://www.iranchamber.com/people/ar...an_turkism.php
                zz jan
                these were not traktor fans BUT Pan Turkish ppl ex Turkey in the name of Traktor fans!
                Ali Jan, sorry but again No AZARI wants to be separated from Iran or a separate govt. I am Azari and have planty of Azari freinds... so I know what I talk about.
                This all thing is done by outsiders IN THE NAME OF Azaris BUT NOT by Azaris themselves.!
                over the past years we have banned abt. 3 members who even joined PFDC and were publishing theri propaganda... they got perm banned from here... we have to look at the broader picture....there is a conspiracy that does not want a united Iran, we have to be more careful and NOT FALL for their tricks...
                at least trust the words of an Azari (as myself) here!!!

                PIREMARD???!!! ur roots are from esfahan?!?!!
                Originally posted by siavasharian
                ESTEGHLAL:

                بهترین خط دفاع.بهترین خط حمله.ثبت رکورد بیشترین گل زده.پر امتیاز ترین تیم ادوار لیگ برتر با ۴۰۹ امتیاز.پر افتخار ترین مربی لیگ برتر با دو قهرمانی
                بهترین گلزن لیگ: آرش برهانی [استقلال] با ۲۱ گل زدهبهترین خط حمله: استقلال تهران با ۷۰ گل زده

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by zzgloo View Post
                  God Bless You.....
                  .
                  thank you.

                  Originally posted by yashar_fasihnia View Post
                  PIREMARD???!!! ur roots are from esfahan?!?!!
                  if you regard Esfahan as part of Azarbajedjan and Tabriz in Ostaaneh Fars, then yes probably.
                  CHECK OUT OUR FORUM RULES HERE: http://www.persianfootball.com/forums/faq.php




                  Don't Select Players That Suit Your Tactics; Select A Tactic That Suits Your Players !!!

                  Comment


                    #10
                    In every culture/ethnicity there are rot apples here and there. What baffles me the most is stereotyping of some of our dear members. such footage from a small crowd ignorantly chanting slogans does not depict all Azeris as "Separatists" same logic may be said about the entire country as a whole, meaning we may see a massive pro-IR crowd rallying the capital of Iran by millions, but is it logical to recognize and acknowledge the legitimacy of the barbaric Islamic regime of Iran based on a large and most definitely illiterate crowd supporting the dictatorship of Iran? HELL NO!

                    As I have mentioned numerous times in the past, I as an Azeri who comes from a very big (By big I mean a large number of relative members ) can guarantee you folks that a huge majority of Iranian Azeris oppose and resent such idiotic movements. We are fully Iranian and then Azeri, that is it.

                    Having all that said, needless to say that the treatment of mainly Tehrani citizens towards other ethnicity of the country seriously needs to be reconsidered. The humiliation of non-farsi Iranians needs to be stopped before it's too late. Non persians shall not feel intimidated and looked down on, nor should they feel as if they were second class citizens!

                    All youtube videos in regards to Iranian Azeri separatism movements are vastly supported by Turks from Turkey and Azeris from republic of Azerbaijan. Most of the comments made in those videos are made by these opportunist imbeciles!

                    Zende baad Irane yekdast va motahed!

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Khamenei is Azeri, they are certainly not a repressed minority if they are able to become the Rahbar of the nation. The IRIB channels in Tabriz and Ardabil are even in their own language.
                      Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Adesor Vafaseya View Post
                        thank you.
                        if you regard Esfahan as part of Azarbajedjan and Tabriz in Ostaaneh Fars, then yes probably.
                        chupane durughu, dige hich harfito nemishe bavar kard
                        Originally posted by siavasharian
                        ESTEGHLAL:

                        بهترین خط دفاع.بهترین خط حمله.ثبت رکورد بیشترین گل زده.پر امتیاز ترین تیم ادوار لیگ برتر با ۴۰۹ امتیاز.پر افتخار ترین مربی لیگ برتر با دو قهرمانی
                        بهترین گلزن لیگ: آرش برهانی [استقلال] با ۲۱ گل زدهبهترین خط حمله: استقلال تهران با ۷۰ گل زده

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by yashar_fasihnia View Post
                          chupane durughu, dige hich harfito nemishe bavar kard

                          when did I ever said I am Esfahani... wtf are u talkin about? lol
                          CHECK OUT OUR FORUM RULES HERE: http://www.persianfootball.com/forums/faq.php




                          Don't Select Players That Suit Your Tactics; Select A Tactic That Suits Your Players !!!

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by Keano View Post
                            In every culture/ethnicity there are rot apples here and there. What baffles me the most is stereotyping of some of our dear members. such footage from a small crowd ignorantly chanting slogans does not depict all Azeris as "Separatists" same logic may be said about the entire country as a whole, meaning we may see a massive pro-IR crowd rallying the capital of Iran by millions, but is it logical to recognize and acknowledge the legitimacy of the barbaric Islamic regime of Iran based on a large and most definitely illiterate crowd supporting the dictatorship of Iran? HELL NO!
                            As I have mentioned numerous times in the past, I as an Azeri who comes from a very big (By big I mean a large number of relative members ) can guarantee you folks that a huge majority of Iranian Azeris oppose and resent such idiotic movements. We are fully Iranian and then Azeri, that is it.
                            Having all that said, needless to say that the treatment of mainly Tehrani citizens towards other ethnicity of the country seriously needs to be reconsidered. The humiliation of non-farsi Iranians needs to be stopped before it's too late. Non persians shall not feel intimidated and looked down on, nor should they feel as if they were second class citizens!
                            All youtube videos in regards to Iranian Azeri separatism movements are vastly supported by Turks from Turkey and Azeris from republic of Azerbaijan. Most of the comments made in those videos are made by these opportunist imbeciles!
                            Zende baad Irane yekdast va motahed!
                            Well said .....

                            How ever,something need to be said,regarding such chants have never ever been existed, and was for the first time .....WHY ?

                            Comment


                              #15
                              We are just a nation in deep sleep! Yes, us so called Iranians!
                              We have been sleeping for over 1400 years.
                              We don’t really understand what is happening around us. We don’t smell the coffee until is too late!
                              The world is trying to divide our country or even our region. (Remind you that may not be all that bad in a bigger scheme of things!! – whole different discussion)
                              They want to re-draw the boarders along the lines of ethnicity or whatever factors that benefit them (geopolitically or economic, etc.). They are after profit and we are still sleeping!
                              The biggest MISTAKE we made in our history (Beside not fighting until the last blood against the Arabs and until we were all vanished) was to change our name (at least to the outside world) from Persia to Iran.
                              Persia was identity, Iran is just a name. Like Iraq or Syria or Lebanon or even Kuwait. Means nothing!
                              Whatever they tell you about the word Iran is b.s. as a name for our nation. We were Persians! Like Germans or French.
                              You don’t see them changing their name to something else to accommodate the other ethnicities (turks, polish, Czech, etc.)
                              Those (Hint: starts with Eng) who cooked up the plan to change our name, knew very well, why they are doing it and what consequence it has. And don’t think their job is done. They are the ones who came up with the New World Order idea !! Remember what happened to Eastern Europe and the Balkans!!
                              They took away our Persian identity. They took away what the Azari and Kurds and Baluchi could identify themselves with to be part of a country.
                              Kurds are more Persian than anyone claims to be. So are Baluchis and Azaris.
                              Now, they are fuelling Azari (turk-zaban e Parsi) to be part of a pan-turkish b.s. – just like the way they brain washed our people to be part of a pan-islamic gargbage that was created 60 years ago in Egypt to revive Arab pride and identity. (Don’t forget Islam is arab identity – that is why they don’t tell us what the truth is behind this religion).
                              So, don’t get me wrong, I am not promoting hard core nationalist movement here to keep our country. But what I am saying is that we need to go back to the core of what brought us together in the first place and see if it is still good to keep us together (and if not let it be!) -- Without that, this blind sighted following of Pan-this and Pan-that will bring us war and destruction. This is for our Azari friends who think separating Azerbaijan is the answer.
                              Let's be Persians! let's tell the world that we are Persians. Let's start a Pan Persian movement and you would be surprised of how many millions of people in that region want to associate with it and be part of it. Pan-Turkish will look like nothing infront of it!!

                              :-)

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