IRAN - BRAZIL B team - discussion

[Martin-Reza]

Messi alone missed numerous great chances, the game was in Japan and hell yes, Japan qualified from WC group stage while we didn't even make it to the qualifcation playoff.

This is Brazil's new team, maybe Kaka, Maicon and Julio Cesar were missing, the rest will probably not be a part of the new team for 2014 anymore. This is the same team that beat USA 2-0, and if you are not happy with a chance-ratio of 3-6 against them on neutral ground, noone can help you anymore. This was no B team and it just shows how much Ghotbi-critics run out of arguments, that a team full of top players is tagged as B team suddenly.

Btw, watching Armenia - Slovakia in Euro quali live on the Armenian satellite channel right now. Armenia are dominating Slovakia and troubling them. We don't always have to downgrade any opposition just to please our self-destructive desires.

[Babak agha]

All by all I think we have the best Asian goalkeeper, once again.
Our central DF's are quite solid for Asian standards.
I don't think physically any Asian team can match us (body strength).
With players like Khalatbari, Rezaei and maybe Madanchi added to our squad, I think we have a real solid team. the only thing that we miss is a good striker and playmaker, but hopefully Karimi will be there for the AC (which I doubt) and Gholami, Ansarifard, Oladi or Meydavoudi will develop into a decent striker by then.
If those things happen, I think we could be one of the favourites for winning the AC. (Player quality wise)
Plus with so many players being tested the last couple of years we have a lot of players with international experience.

Edit - I forgot about the RB and LB positions where we truly suck...

[Paradigm]

Looks like Ghotbi has his work cut out for him to win the Asian Cup 2011 :

October 8, 2010

SAITAMA, Japan (AFP) - Japan upset a full-strength Argentina side 1-0 Friday in a historic friendly win that crowned the coaching debut of former AC Milan boss Alberto Zaccheroni.

Shimizu S-Pulse striker Shinji Okazaki scored the winner in the 19th minute while the Blue Samurai stopped several scoring attempts by Barcelona star Lionel Messi.

Messi's 25-metre free kick in stoppage time banged off a Japanese wall and a sold-out crowd of more than 60,000 At the Saitama Stadium roared in joy at the final whistle.

It was the first win for the Blue Samurai in seven international matches against Argentina.

The result ended Argentina caretaker coach Sergio Batista's 100 percent record since he took over from Diego Maradona after the South Americans crumbled to Germany in the World Cup quarter-finals.

Batista's squad beat Ireland 1-0 away on August 12 and crushed world champions Spain 4-1 at home on September 7, but came unstuck against a committed Japanese side.

"I feel very happy. My debut match turned out to be such an important event," said the 57-year-old Italian Zaccheroni, who has managed six Serie-A teams.

"I told my players in the bench before the match that if you work hard it will produce a result."

Japan, who reached the last-16 in South Africa for their best World Cup finish on foreign soil, fielded seven European-based players.

Many among the crowd were keen to catch an up-close glimpse of Barcelona superstar Lionel Messi. They did not have long to wait as Messi squandered two early chances, lofting the ball onto the top of the net after trapping a return pass in front of goal in the seventh minute.

Seven minutes later he dribbled up the field and attacked from the right but Lierse goalkeeper Eiji Kawashima deflected his effort.

Okazaki's goal came after Argentina goalkeeper Sergo Romero punched a 30-metre shot by Japan captain and Wolfsburg midfiedler Makoto Hasebe.

Okazaki rushed into the box and hit the rebound beyond the diving Romero into the right corner of the net.

In the 27th minute, Kawashima had to stretch to stop Messi's 30-metre free kick.

But Japan too had chances to extend their lead. Two shots by CSKA Moscow midfielder Keisuke Honda and Schalke defender Atsuto Uchida within five minutes from half-time went either straight into the keeper's hands or over the bar.

Deep into the second half Manchester City striker Carlos Teves trapped a cross from Messi off guard in the area and slapped it far wide.

On 70 minutes, J-League leading scorer Ryoichi Maeda nearly doubled the score when he dribbled away from Argentine defenders and shot off the right post.

Messi bungled another chance in the 75th minute when he slammed a Tevez cross to straight to Kawashima.

Japan came close to scoring again in the 88th minute when Maeda dribbled past two Argentine defenders but his left-foot shot was swept away by Romero.

[Doctor DOOM]

Btw, watching Armenia - Slovakia in Euro quali live ........

hahaha. buddy, this sort of "reasoning" may go in general forum, not here.
I put more value and emphasis on the QUALITY of the game played and armenia apart from some 15 minutes in second half was pretty awful. so we didnt really face anything of quality.
dont hide behind superficial things like "names". a remnant trait from some years ago


secondly, anyone who watches both iran-brazil and japan-arg games will discover the vast difference in the quality (key factor. not just the "name" ) of the teams and the games.

as for me, I'm sorry to disappoint you for not keeping my eyes closed to a pattern of recurring weaknesses and shortcomings.
I guess your excuse is the same one as years ago; X is the coach, so he knows better!!!


whooaaa ... deja-vu !!!


***********

and so what if that was in japan and ours wasnt in tehran?
are you trying to say we shd expect quality only in Iran , or it is ok to have this many deficiencies when we play outside Iran?

how does that have an impact on selection of the brazilian squad (in fact given iran's reputation we could have seen even a more depleted brazilian squad!)

*****************

anyway, I am not saying why we lost by 3-0 or why we lost to brazil or .... . all that is irrelevant.

what IS relevant and I'd like to stress on is no matter who our opponent, be it oman's youth or brazil (olympic or not), we are showing the SAME weaknesses & deficiencies!

and these are issues that have persisted FOR A LONG TIME. that means after more than a year, ghotbi has either not noticed them or has been incapable to address them. either way it points to his unsuitability to lead the team.

no matter if we're facing south korea or kuwait's olympic team, we still suffer from using the wrong players, lack of tactics, bad arrangement, ridiculous defensive lapses, impotent forwards, ...etc.

and the WORST thing we can do is to hide behind meaningless scorelines (in friendlies) or the "name/reputation" of the opposition. the absolute worst.


whooaaa .... another deja-vu (from 2005)

[Paradigm]

Here is the FIFA article on Iran-Brazil, again no mention of the Gholami's goal which could have changed the dynamics of the game. Btw. I thought Brazil's second goal looked offside, anyone saw the same?

Iran provide second Menezes win

[Martin-Reza]

No, it wasn't offside, thanks to Heydari.

Btw, Armenia leading Slovakia 3-1 shortly before the end of the game. Any conclusions about Iran from that or only from matches between two teams Iran didn't play against recently?

[Doctor DOOM]

^
spain won the WC --- > spain, world champions ----> argentina 4 - pain 1 -----> arg, world's champs ---> japan 1 - arg 0 -----> japan, world champs ----> skorea 2 - japan 1 -----> south korea, world champs ----> south korea 0 - maldives 0 ----> maldives, THE FREAKING WORLD CHAMPIONS

meaning Maldives is better than brazil, spain, holland, arg, ... arreh o ooreh o shamsi kooreh, eh?


your kind of logic

[Babak agha]

^Actually we beat SK aswell, so we are the true champions..

[Hajagha]

^
spain won the WC --- > spain, world champions ----> argentina 4 - pain 1 -----> arg, world's champs ---> japan 1 - arg 0 -----> japan, world champs ----> skorea 2 - japan 1 -----> south korea, world champs ----> south korea 0 - maldives 0 ----> maldives, THE FREAKING WORLD CHAMPIONS

meaning Maldives is better than brazil, spain, holland, arg, ... arreh o ooreh o shamsi kooreh, eh?


your kind of logic

forget your provoking.

Wondering DD joon, when you get satisfied? Just give me one game that you were satisfied with every thing. I don't recall it. Hey, don't go over last 5 years. We only have 5 years record in PFDC.

Cheers,

[Keano]

No, it wasn't offside, thanks to Heydari.

Btw, Armenia leading Slovakia 3-1 shortly before the end of the game. Any conclusions about Iran from that or only from matches between two teams Iran didn't play against recently?

MR jaan,

According to some of our beloved members, the games TM win do not count, we traditionally do not fancy praising and admiring success and furthermore good results, yet won't hesitate to bash and criticize as soon as we fail or do not impress in all aspects of our lives, not just football for that matter! beating Armenia, China, S. Korea all away do not matter and all are considered to be worthless, however bowing down somewhat respectfully brings us such huge shame and embarrassment! How frisky are we?

Oh How cynical are we?

[Babak agha]

Just watched the first half of the game again, thanks to Mr. (or is it Ms. by now ) soniq's upload:

It didn't take the AD Sport commentator even half an hour to conclude the following:

- The tactic isn't working, Ghotbi should be looking for some changes
- Gholami isn't receiving any service nor support
- Gholami is all up on his own all the time
- The system isn't working

Seems our coach and some members here need some longer processing time :P

ps: Nekounam was one of the weakest links in the first half. Neku, Nouri and our LM were next to nothing. Too many turn overs, bad decision making and passing, and even very bad defending, especially on Neku's behalf.

At least Hajsafi had 2-3 very good sliding tackles and was able to pass the ball without loosing it.

Pss: @ DD: we did have two shot attempts in the first half, one by Hajsafi and one by Heidari (no matter how embarrassing they were)

[Doctor DOOM]

^ babak jan, those "attempts" that as we say "asemoon ro jer mideh" or hit the stadium clock are not counted. anything within a few yards' vicinity of the goal is acceptable.

************************

On 2nd viewing;
First half

1- Aside from the first 15-18 min’s, we had very little to offer and hardly entered brazil’s 1/3rd.

2- Any possession we had wa shared bet our defenders and DM’s coming deep to touch the ball, in case we forget they are present in the game.

3- The handful of times we somehow found ourselves in brazil’s 1/3rd, either shojaei lost the ball on the right, or hajsafi lost in on the left!!!
I’m tempted to say if we had played with 9 men (without these two), we’d have fared far better than we did in this half. At least we wouldn’t pass it to these two for them to just give it away or waste the ball!!!!

I even didn’t know why the Brazilians fouled on shojaei on those 2-3 instances. They shd have just waited a second, for him to receive the ball and he’d have given the ball up anyway a moment after that. Why risk a freekick when you WILL get the ball in a moment or two?

4- Z-pour’s freekick unluckily hit gholami’s leg. Otherwise it would have gone through the wall and definitely troubled the keeper. I don’t know why we keep a player there without telling him what to do or where to stand!! It looks like while watching ESPN back in UCLA, we’ve seen teams keeping players to stand there. But we haven’t understood why. So we just tell a player to merely stand there!!! What for? Don’t ask!!!

5- Brazil’s (Olympic) players hardly pushed or exerted themselves. They played the remaining 30 minutes of the game at walking pace. This is certainly NOT heir style.
I’m willing to bet if they had played this way against japan, they’d have lost by more than 3-4 goals.

6- Hajsafi truly played terribly. Be it his shooting, crossing, passing, positioning, … etc. even his corners and crosses were extremelh poor.



SECOND HALF-

- On nekou’s attempt that hit the post. Just thinking, maybe if jalal had tried to go in with the ball, would have somehow carried the ball into the goal with himself. Be it with his stomach or scrotom or chest or whatever.

- If we’re to allot the blame for the second goal, the bulk of it lies on the def-mids who were missing and spectators. Nosrati also gets taken and leaves a gap in his place as he comes forward.
And the player who filled the offside was NOT heidari as much as martin loves to target him for everything. It was hosseini (watch the picture sequence).



- After the second goal, our level and desire dropped sharply and with quite a few non-performers (mobaali, ansarifard, bagheri, ...) on the pitch, we basically went through the motions of finishing the game … until the last bagheri pass to meydavoudi, who shd have done better.



****** If you watched the first 15-18 minutes of the first half, and the first 20-25 minutes of the second half, you’d be ok and even satisfied with Iran’s performance, even inclusive of the mistakes and give aways. After all the name of the opponent is brazil.
But the 30 minutes of the first half and the other 20 of the second half leaves MUCH to be desired .... in both teams.
even brazil was just passing the ball around in a BORED manner as if they cant wait to finish the bloody game so they can get to their hotels!!! no interest. no drive. no intent or purpose! nothing.


**** Since I’m told to be more positive, I’d enumerate the highlights of the game for an Iranian:

1- Gholami’s goal. f**k the stupid ref who were biased throughout the match and didn’t allow this.

2- Nekounam’s chip hitting the post

3- Nosrati showing no undue respect to the Brazilians from the get go and not allowing the name of brazil to affect him. Same thing with Hosseini.

4- Rahmati’s heroics. Marvelous showcase for him.

5- Bagheri’s pass to meydavoudi that could have ended as a goal

There. These are moments and instances that would make me pleased.

[Doctor DOOM]

apparently some of you think I'm complaining becoz " we lost to brazil" 3-0.
no. dont worry.
the instances I pick are the problems that KEEP REPEATING in so many games irrespective of the opponent, be it oman, brazil, kuwait, china, ... etc
the kind of mistakes that will crop up again and again if we dont address them.


hope this clears matters up

[Paradigm]

Imagine if we could score one like this on Brazil

[Babak agha]

^ babak jan, those "attempts" that as we say "asemoon ro jer mideh" or hit the stadium clock are not counted. anything within a few yards' vicinity of the goal is acceptable.

Hahaha I wish those attempts were "asemoon ro jer mideh" types, especially Heidari's attempt.

BTW did you guys notice the arguing about who would take the freekick? it was more evident from the Iranian broadcast side and not so much from the int. broadcast side (in the iranian broadcast Iran started from right to left and the int. broadcast Iran started from left to right)

Hajsafi and z.pour were arguing with each other and Neku, for taking the free kick. After that didn't help they started shouting and pointing to the coaching staff to ask permission for taking the freekick. The int. broadcast does however show Z.pour begging both Hajsafi and Neku, to let him take the freekick. So much for the hierarchic and organization in TM.

ps: about the walking about on the pitch, both by Brazilians and Iranians, did you notice how hot and humid it was? The ref was sweating like some kind of farm animal before he even whistled the start sign. in less than 10 min every jersey was soaking wet as if the players were gone swimming in their jerseys. Each time Hajsafi went for a throw in he whipped his hands off on the boards behinf him, did you notice how much sweat came off? I can't blame anyone for not "running" there.