Jordan - Iran (friendly)

[maij]

To answer Majid's question :"What about Branko Ivankovic when it came to selecting young , not famous and promising players? How would he stand amongst the rest of Team Melli coaches?"
... aside from detecting a hint of mischief in that Q, I think I have to remind us all of a couple of key points:

Hheeeheheee...... Aah...I love yor humor...what would this forum be without you ?

1- the NO-NAME selection was NOT done by branko. it was his boss, CIRO who chose those no-name players who became stars of the team on their own. rahman rezaei was oicked by ciro. so was mirzapour and a few others. not branko.

2- later, after firing ciro, branko was chosen to head our U-23 team that was again LOADED with magnificent talent the likes of which we've never had in our olympic squads post revolution. check out the names:
mobaali, kazemian, nekounam, lotfi, bayatinia, ... . they won the asian gamea and while some were already famous players, the rest also became house-hold names.

and when this team won the asian games, it was only natural for the bulk of this team to be included in the future seniors team that already had plenty of stars like bagheir, karimi, daei, kia, ... etc in it.

3- I'd even say branko actually RESISTED bringing NEW players. worse, if the player was not famous too.
remember how he stuck with a set bunch of 9-10 players throughout his last 2 years, with never changing or trying out alternatives for his main squad? ... no matter how lousy the opponent or how meaningless the test games?
(how some of us screamed why he didnt dare try alternatives?)
and how his brain-dead strategy bit us (who the hell cares about the wimp. he got his money and became famous off our back) in the arse when one by one his stars and fixed players fell to injury (kia, VH, karimi, ... etc) at the worst possible moment (right at the WC)?

so my answer to your Q is: bro, I HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT. that thing doesnt even EXIST

OK.... Branko or Ciro , Chiro and Branko or any combination or singular of them, they did in fact bring some lessor known players who later became household names in their own right. Even if Branko was cautious and hardly changed his tactics , we must give him the credit for the new players.

[maij]

Did you guys see the scene where Aghili hit the Jordanian player? He dropped like a fruit from the tree... Could have been a red card.

This is called amateurish stupidity . The Arabs are quite cunning and our players are suckers. It is even worst for the likes of Aghili and Khalatbary who played with these cheats , yet the easily fall prey to their dirty tactics and gamesmanship !!

To succeed as a player , it is very important to have enough brain cells up there in addition to the muscles.

[Kaiser Amir]

I really don't know about this Carlos Queroz. He might have been the best coach in the World at some stage , but I honestly do not see the slightest of improvements since he took over the team. He has been at it for 14 months now , so , no more of this give him time business. He has to deliver , and time is not a luxury that he has.

My exact sentiments.
I'm baffled how this Team Melli is showing ZERO signs of improvement.

I accept that the players are mediocre (new ones) and fading starts of yesterday, but, still, I expected more after all the hype surrouding Queiroz.

I never expected us to play like Barcelona, but, right now, we're definitely playing like a second division romanian club and without being ironic, even a second division romanian club has more pace / speed in its football than Team Melli.

[St_Mark]

Queiroz Has been successful in lowering expectations of Our players, teams and capabilities
slowly emerges his influence and changes , not all impressive.

[KeonKish]

Another game, another poor performance by Team Melli...

To begin with, CQ is fully responsible for this loss. After 14 months on the job he has failed to reform a weak midfield which has significantly brought down the pace of our game. What's even worse is that many of his chosen players are either under-performing in their respective clubs or fail to get any playing time at all!

Before setting CQ on fire for his lack of variety in player selection, let's see what he has done thus far in each position.

Goalkeepers: A rather satisfactory selection which constantly features Haghighi and Rahmati. Given Gordan's poor performance over the past season, he's slowly lost his place to Forouzan who will provide good competition for Haghighi to becoming Rahmati's successor.

I don't see Ahmadi in TM beyond this single call-up (given Forouzan's Visa issues). I respect Ahmadi for what he did with Sepahan last season and thus far with Saipa but the player is already 32. Given that Rahmati will be our chosen keeper for at least another two years, I don't see the logic in bringing in an older keeper as the back-up (unless that player already has some experience in the national team to which Ahmadi only has 1 cap).

Lastly, one frequent issue that has been brought up is that of Rahmati. I agree that Rahmati is extremely indecisive when it comes to coming out of his box but he is undoubtedly the best we have in this position and possibly third best in the history of our football (behind Hejazi and Abedzadeh). Unless he starts making serious errors in the WCQ matches, he will be our #1 keeper.

Defence: As far as reforms go, this is probably CQ's biggest success. With the introduction of Pouladi, Mahini, and Montazeri, CQ has found intelligent players in all three defensive positions. Also, the fact that Pouladi and Mahini are 25 make them long-term investments for TM.

Our LB position has been at its best under CQ with both Pouladi and Hajsafi capable of getting the job done. I also like how Pouladi is more defensive-minded where Hajsafi is more offensive-minded (ignoring his poor game today). Such depth really helps when it comes to facing various opponents.

The same can be said about our RB position. Of course, neither Mahini or Heydari will ever measure up to Mahdavikia but they get the job done. Mahini is definitely the more intelligent of the two and has more variety to his game but I'm glad to see that Heydari has been connecting well in plays with Dejagah.

In the CB position, I'm going to take a guess and assume that CQ is beginning to favor a Hosseini & Montazeri partnership over an Aghili & Hosseini partnership. I'm personally in complete agreement with this given combination and hope to see Aghili phased out of Team Melli soon. Should Aghili be replaced by Khalilzadeh in future TM lists, I'll fully give credit to CQ for his selections in this department.

Forwards: Similar to our defensive line, CQ has a lot of variety in our forward line. With the introduction of Dejagah, Ghazi, and soon, Gucci, we'll have an extremely capable attack. Khalatbari is a great technical and speedy player but the guy has an extremely low IQ. If he's not at his best, he'll be a serious liability to the team given some poor decision making and selfishness on the ball. Luckily, he's been looking sharper since moving to Sepahan.

Apart from our midfield, CQ's biggest failure has been Ansarifard. First he drops Ansarifard given his poor performances only to call him back up following Dejagah's injury (fair enough). What really rattles me is the fact that this very same player gets the nod to start against Jordan. To his credit, he did play better today than in the past few games but his playing time was undeserved. Calling up and starting players that are performing poorly instills a sense of entitlement in that player and takes away from the fact that he needs to improve. I'm sure we'd all like to see Ansarifard succeed but I think CQ has been approaching this situation very poorly.

As I mentioned in another thread, the sixth forward position should be used to invite a play who is performing well in the league. Whether that player is Rafkhaei or M. Ebrahimi, there a few forwards that deserve to be given a shot in Team Melli. I'd personally like to see Afshin again but it seems his frequent injuries last season has taken him out of the spotlight. It's fair to not that CQ has invited a few other 'new' forwards in the past (i.e. Saeed Daghighi).

Midfield: Absolute disaster. Old. Slow. Terrible. Nekounam is 31. Karimi is 33. Zare is 27. Pejman Nouri is 32. Mohammad Nouri is 29. Ando is 29. Hadadifar is 28. Shojaei is 28. Excluding Nazari, the average age of this line will be roughly 32 by 2014. If these players were running around like Paul Scholes and Ryan Giggs, I would keep my mouth shut but each of them has been unimpressive.

Nekounam is our captain and we'll have to deal with him for another two years whether we want to or not. Toss Masoud in that crowd and he becomes veteran #2. I personally like what I'm seeing from Nazari but I don't think we've seen the best of him yet. I'd give him another 2-3 games to acclimatize himself with the national team. If we want to be diplomatic and have balance in this line, take your pick between Ando and M. Nouri but stop there. The rest should be dropped and told that they will no longer be called up (similar to Ballack and Beckham). The longer we drag these players, the longer they'll feel entitled to a spot in a potential World Cup team. Furthermore, the longer we hold on these players, the less time will be given to our youngsters.

With roughly two spots remaining, these MUST be given to the future of our midfield. Players like Y. Karimi, Haghighi, and Mosalman have been consistently playing well but are not being rewarded for it. If Team Melli isn't going to be merit based to some degree, then what do these players have to play towards or aspire to? Again, this line has been CQ's biggest failure.

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Looking beyond our players, I'm surprised that nobody has yet to address the 4-3-3 system that is being employed by CQ. This system requires excellent passing and the ability to maintain possession - two qualities which TM lacks. Personally, I feel that changing back to 4-4-2 would be the most beneficial system to Team Melli.

Should Gucci live up to his name (being of high quality ), I'd like to see him as a supporting striker to Ghazi. I'd then place Dejagah as a right winger (his natural position), Shojaei as our AM, Nekounam as our DM, and experiment with a left winger.

With Dejagah, Gucci, Ghazi, Montazeri, Pouladi, Forouzan, Mahini, Nazari, and possibly Khalilzadeh, CQ has introduced 9 new players to Team Melli. However, the reason we're not 'seeing' this is due to the fact that we've yet to see major reform in the backbone of any team: the midfield.

I only disagree with you on ONE point, how exactly has Ando dissapointed? He has not made any crucial mistakes and has been pretty consistent for a LONG time now. Nekounam did fade a little, karimi is on and off, and the rest are meh. But ando hasn't really done anything wrong and is still full of energy, pity we wont have him against lebanon.

[maij]

My exact sentiments.
I'm baffled how this Team Melli is showing ZERO signs of improvement.

I accept that the players are mediocre (new ones) and fading starts of yesterday, but, still, I expected more after all the hype surrouding Queiroz.

I never expected us to play like Barcelona, but, right now, we're definitely playing like a second division romanian club and without being ironic, even a second division romanian club has more pace / speed in its football than Team Melli.

I really want to re-visit the "Carlos Queiroz Effects" after the Korea match in October , as that would be the conclusion of the first part of the qualification program where we really would have a pretty good idea where we stand.

[Kaiser Amir]

maij Jan,

I'm going to say something and I hope from the bottom of my heart that I'm wrong:

In teami ke ma darim alan, ba in footballi ke ina bazi mikonan, hich shansi jeloye Koreye Junubi nadaran, na tu Tehran, na tu Seoul, na tu Koreye mah.

You've been following iranian football longer than me.
Do you remember an iranian team as weak as this one?

I don't. Honestly.

Add to that the fact that South Korea has, probably, its best team ever right now.

[K. Nader]

I only disagree with you on ONE point, how exactly has Ando dissapointed? He has not made any crucial mistakes and has been pretty consistent for a LONG time now. Nekounam did fade a little, karimi is on and off, and the rest are meh. But ando hasn't really done anything wrong and is still full of energy, pity we wont have him against lebanon.

I never said Ando has disappointed. All I'm saying is that in a midfield list which (under CQ) consists of normally six players, we need to pick our 2-3 veterans now and move forward. If it were up to me, I'd take Nekounam, Ando, and Shojaei and leave the rest behind (i.e. Karimi, P. Nouri, Hadadifard, Jabbari, etc.).

Of course, exceptions can be made should a player incur an injury but I'd much rather see a midfield list that looks something like Nekounam, Masoud, Ando, Mosalman, Haghighi, and Nazari than one that looks like Nekounam, Karimi, P. Nouri, Ando, Shojaei, and Hadadifar.

[Doctor DOOM]

^ change shojaei's and hadadifar's places and we've got deal.

shojaei just never did it for me. after the first 4-6 early caps (that EVERY player deserves liniency and time to show his stuff. even the likes of ansarifard, ebrahimi, nazari, nowrouzi, enayati, ..., of whom some got their chance and some were denied of it!!), he never convinced me he is able to really be an asset to TM.
yeah, yeah, he scored a couple of goals against korea and that's all great (lets not delve in his stomach connecting with the ball rather than actually hitting the ball in korea). he seemed too insistent on dribbling at the cost of the team's momentum. and while he is quick footed WITHOUT the ball, with the ball, especially when dribbling, he really slows down and becomes a drag on the team.

most successful dribblers do it maintaining a certain forward speed. aside from the likes of messi as an example, I think even karimi can maintain a good forward movement pace while dribbling. shojaei (at least until his big injury) hardly showed this.

so when a player slows down for a particular task ... AND INSISTS ON DOING THAT TASK OVER AND OVER in a game, then he wont be much of an asset to the team.


Hadadrifar's case is different. at present he seems to be slightly out of form (no wonder with all the shuffling around between clubs and his participation in zob's games not sanctioned for weeks ...). But when in form, he seems an extremely useful player for any team.
he is a very engaging midfielder who doesnt shy away from physical war with the opponents (shojaei usually comes second best in such situations due to, perhaps, weaker upper body). He is constantly moving about, tackling and hustling.
he also has a great eye for through passes into spaces between defenders. something that is severely lacking in almost 99% of our players (wt exception of the master of through pass navidkia and karimi and maybe another chap).
he also has a pretty good long range shot.
he is just a good hard worker with very little ego or "hashiyeh".
His problem is he's a bit short and cant be used for aerial battles or set pieces. But in no team are there 11 tall players used for set pieces.



Md Nouri is inconsistent. otherwise he'd be an asset too. at times he can be very good and at times a source of frustration.
But when we have the likes of mosalman and sadeghiyan waiting in the wings, I'd say lets make way for the younger lads to start geling into the team

[K. Nader]

^^^

I do agree on your points about Shojaei and have voiced my opinion on his minimal influence in TM. Unfortunately, one only needs to score against S. Korea or the Saudis to be considered an important player. Also, having watched Osasuna matches, I can say that Shojaei performs to a fraction of his abilities for his country.

I chose Shojaei over Hadadifar based on realism. As an Iranian player, the unwritten rule is that once you're in Europe, you are guaranteed a spot in the national team. Unlike Japan, we do not have the luxury of having 20+ players in Europe, of which only 12 to 13 are normally chosen for the national team (based on good club performances I suppose). I would argue against Shojaei's inclusion more in the regular forum but I would get attacked from all directions because Shojaei is the player that did that one thing that one time.

[Doctor DOOM]

^^^

I do agree on your points about Shojaei and have voiced my opinion on his minimal influence in TM. Unfortunately, one only needs to score against S. Korea or the Saudis to be considered an important player. Also, having watched Osasuna matches, I can say that Shojaei performs to a fraction of his abilities for his country.

I chose Shojaei over Hadadifar based on realism. As an Iranian player, the unwritten rule is that once you're in Europe, you are guaranteed a spot in the national team. Unlike Japan, we do not have the luxury of having 20+ players in Europe, of which only 12 to 13 are normally chosen for the national team (based on good club performances I suppose). I would argue against Shojaei's inclusion more in the regular forum but I would get attacked from all directions because Shojaei is the player that did that one thing that one time.

lol. very true.
all a player got to do is do ONE memorable thing and he's set for life in Iran!

and I am talking about abolishing that stupid, senseless unwritten rule that has plagued our TM and int'l football for more than a decade.
it's pretty much NAME-based selection than capability or FORM.
tomorrow a player may walk in crutches and he'll get more nods from fans and even selectors than another domestic player. worse, if the domestic player plays in a less high profile club too. in that case God only shd help him to get NOTICED, .. let alone receive enough backing to get called or stay at TM.

a look at the present TM shows ss, pp, sepahan and traktorsazi ruling the roost.
how many are outside these 4 popular clubs (including legionnaires)? hadadifar (zob). any more? I cant remember.
and that's sad.

shojaei waltzes in after 18-19 months and STARTS!!
what should a lad like mosalman or afshin or rahmani or sadeghiyan or .... do to get called? play well for his club? Surely it cant be that. It definitely cant be that.
no wonder we have such a hard time replacing our aging stars.
because when the time comes to give the younger generation confidence and self-assurance that they are on the right path and will be rewarded for their efforts, our coaches and selectors stab them in the back and effectively tell them "no matter how hard you try, no matter how well you play, no matter how many goals you score/prevent/make/... you are a second class player as long as the more famous X or Y are there"
and naturally we see many of these lads lose form and really get reduced to average players (case in point, arash afshin)!

[toofan]

would have been interesting if CQ had iran's players of 98 and even 2002.

now, our players quality is not as before.

[Paradigm]

Below is by far the most unbelievable PK shootout (in the manner it went down) I have seen in the past decade. It involves Jordan, and I think it was a big effect in bringing their morals down for the return leg of the WCQ 2006 with Iran. They had beaten us 1-0 in Azadi back in 2004 during the first leg, and there were legitimate questions whether Iran can snatch any points in Amman. If I recall correctly in the difficult next-to-last stage of the Asian qualifications for 2006 all crucial victories went down to the last 10 minutes of the two games versus Jordan and Qatar. It was widely assumed the two Arab teams may watch for each other so at least one would go through, and Iran had no clear choice but two crucial away wins in the last two games. (The very final stage of the qualification was actually easier.)