surprise, surprise ... CQ refuses to play Italy

[Doctor DOOM]

You know you are right when the counter argument to your explanations and reasoning is basically ''how dare you question CQ'' in various forms of this statement, and very little else in terms of expounding and dissecting the issue itself.

Cheers all




Then in the middle of it all, here comes rugs' old, tired and absolutely nonsensical mantra of ''you don't know Iran unless you live on it right now''!!!
Give it up mate. You never made sense with this. And nothing has changed either. In fact if one steps outside Iran once nana while, one can see a whole lot of things that are usually kept secret or hidden from public inside. So your trite silly argument is actually ironically wrong.
Pick something else.

[Kiarash]

How dare we to refuse paying Italy 1.5 million for a friendly game where they most probably will field their B-players.

Marg bar CQ

[Martin-Reza]

They can't even pay for the own accomodation and flight to play Chile, but they can pay a million to play Italy? Very likely scenario. Lol at everyone believing this bullshit.

[Doctor DOOM]

^ by that token then, are we to assume TM won't have ANY test games or camps or .... unless someone invites us and os ready to pay for everything?
Are you saying that?

Coz if you aren't, then you must know even a simple camp/tour costs us about 350-500K depending on the location, accommodations and length of the tour.
Now, if you want to play a decent team, ... and I mean DECENT... Not the usual crap we pass off as opponents, you've gotta pay their fees too.
Decent team, because we need to find out what we're capable of withstanding. Not for the sake of making our records more plump which serves nobody except the coach and statisticians.

So a week or 10 days long camp somewhere in Europe including a game against a decent opposition plus another against a mediocre team costs pretty much around the cost of the Italy game.
Lets not forget that you WILL HAVE sponsors for the Italy game, but not so much for the said camp.

[AminGP]

Japan started gaining international respect after playing countless amount of friendlies against Brazil, France, Argentina, Italy, Netherlands etc...

Playing against top tier teams is good publicity for our players and us. Remember the recognition we got after playing Argentina and how everyone was praising our team? Hopefully once the sanctions are lifted, IFF would be able to withdraw the price money of world cup and set up some top friendly games.

[O-ZoNe]

surprise, surprise ... CQ refuses to play Italy

The simple problem with this thread is that Doctor DOOM has INTENTIONALLY altered facts as a means of serving his own agenda which is a defamation of Carlos Queiroz's character. There is no issue with discussing CQ and his pros and cons and that means sitting down and looking at the situation objectively. Condoning this type of thread which is nothing short of propaganda is just wrong.

Relax...this is a DISCUSSION forum not the hague. In the end I suspect the truth lies somewhere between DD's view and the unequivocal CQ supporters. Like I said before, TM, IFF, CQ and all other fans can't afford to see match days wasted. Regardless who is to blame, the planning is piss poor again and the match day is likely going to pass us by!

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[xerexes]

1. Stupid thread, close it.

2. The people who say things like "Why do Iranians think CQ is God" and other nonsense have probably never lived or worked in Iran and are just your average kids raised abroad with no sense of how Iran really is but have the audacity to make comments about actual Iranians because they had a 2 week vacation there. If they were actual Iranians, they would realize that for once in their lives, Iranians are seeing someone come on TV and speak the truth to them with the respect they deserve and without any BS. That is why Iranians like CQ, because for once they feel like they have someone that cares about them instead of the typical kaffashian/kashani/f-zadeh/rooyanian-esque official that has the status quo's interest in mind. It's not "kharaji-parasti" or "bot-parasti", it is "no-nonsense" parasti.
3. If that didn't get through your thick skulls, try to understand that Iranians like CQ for the same reasons they liked Hejazi.
4. Go and ask some real Iranians for insight before you make silly comments.

This! Every word of this!

[K. Nader]

Relax...this is a DISCUSSION forum not the hague. In the end I suspect the truth lies somewhere between DD's view and the unequivocal CQ supporters. Like I said before, TM, IFF, CQ and all other fans can't afford to see match days wasted. Regardless who is to blame, the planning is piss poor again and the match day is likely going to pass us by!

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For the longest of time, you've kept saying that 'X', 'Y', and 'Z' are problems of the Iranian culture and mentality yet you're condoning defamation of character and propaganda. It's one thing for DD to post his views in an existing thread where the issue was already brought up. It's another to open an entirely new thread and brand an opinion (his opinion) as the definitive truth.

[clipsport]

I think with this news and the release of the new TM list, all these Keyroshipours and CQ worshipers are having a hard time keeping up with CQ's bullsh*t and consistent contradictions.

[Bi-honar]

The truth lies somewhere between the two extremes

With your permission Ozone jaan, I made a small correction and I think we (as a community here and as a country out there) should rinse and repeat that statement until it sinks in and becomes 2nd nature to all of us, 'cause as it stands almost every discussion about every topic gravitates to the two extremes.

The saddest part is that each extreme refuses to recognize the rigidity and extremism in their position while they accuse the other side of doing the same thing.

[O-ZoNe]

For the longest of time, you've kept saying that 'X', 'Y', and 'Z' are problems of the Iranian culture and mentality yet you're condoning defamation of character and propaganda. It's one thing for DD to post his views in an existing thread where the issue was already brought up. It's another to open an entirely new thread and brand an opinion (his opinion) as the definitive truth.

Actually, I am pretty sure it was "A", "B", and "C"...but that's besides the point. This is a discussion forum, where some people will debate, others argue, some inform, while the rest preach. I don't agree with some things DD says, nor do I disagree with other points he makes. Same goes with you and other members as well. This the internet, I think DD has to do a lot worst for it to be considered "defamation of character". I mean if DD is defaming anyone, then what would you call navad, the Iranian media, world politics...etc etc. because those are far worst. Heck I have seen CQ say much worst things about others and yet we praise that.

Like I said, everything has become polarized. You either worship CQ, or you are his mortal enemy. We are all either Shojaie's or GN's when it comes to CQ. Is that going to change? Likely not...did it need it's own thread, perhaps not, but is he "killing" anyone by doing it? Certainly not...and I don't mind this thread since it brought the debate out of TM News where everyone had their undies in a bunch because they weren't getting round the clock up to the minute news about TM. Relax, live and let live mate

[Mr.Click]

I'll wait to see what the alternative nations are. If we play Uzbekistan/New Zealand/Egypt instead of playing Italy I would say that is a great call. Playing countries far below us will not help us in the long run.

the three mentioned countries should not require any money to play against

[perspolis#1]

the three mentioned countries should not require any money to play against

Thats the point. Some members need to realize one match against Italy will not fix anything. Iran learned much more playing Guinea than we learned from playing Brazil in a sponsored friendly. We adapted our team to African stamina levels after the friendly and got a point against Nigeria. If we play teams one or two levels above us consistently our players benefit far more. Imagine if we played Ghana and Croatia as well before the WC. We would have taken Bosnia the last game and finished Nigeria off when they aimlessly passed around in the second half.


Teams we gain nothing from playing: All Middle East Arabs bar UAE(Arab slow pace of play makes us slower.), any eastern african country, SouthEast Asian teams, one times versus a nation with a B team after we pay 1.5 million.


Teams we do gain a lot from:

1) West Africa(Ghana, Ivory Coast, Nigeria, etc), all of North Africa(Egypt is always good/Algeria smoked South Korea),

2) Virtually ANY team from CONMEBOL ( we arent paying Chile 1.5 million) and top CONCACAF sides(Mexico, Costa Rica, Honduras),

3) Any team from Europe's top 30 nations. ( we couldnt beat Albania so lets focus on getting a flowing game against Montenegro/Albania first)

4) The Asian atypicals: China/Japan/Uzbekistan/Korea Republic/ Australia. The other teams are below TM by more than one level and only disrupt us practicing PASSING.

5) CAFF: Solely to respect the organization and find new players. On Non Fifa days we could arrange games where Taremi, Sharifi and co get so much experience in a TM shirt. Prive themselves there and CQ WILL bump them to the main squad

[Bi-honar]

Actually, I am pretty sure it was "A", "B", and "C"...but that's besides the point. This is a discussion forum, where some people will debate, others argue, some inform, while the rest preach. I don't agree with some things DD says, nor do I disagree with other points he makes. Same goes with you and other members as well. This the internet, I think DD has to do a lot worst for it to be considered "defamation of character". I mean if DD is defaming anyone, then what would you call navad, the Iranian media, world politics...etc etc. because those are far worst. Heck I have seen CQ say much worst things about others and yet we praise that.

Like I said, everything has become polarized. You either worship CQ, or you are his mortal enemy. We are all either Shojaie's or GN's when it comes to CQ. Is that going to change? Likely not...did it need it's own thread, perhaps not, but is he "killing" anyone by doing it? Certainly not...and I don't mind this thread since it brought the debate out of TM News where everyone had their undies in a bunch because they weren't getting round the clock up to the minute news about TM. Relax, live and let live mate

Well said Ozone jaan. Nader's actually one of those members I don't agree with some time, but still enjoy reading his comments and have caught myself shifting my position because of them more than once. The same goes for the rest of the "inform and debate" crowd regardless of their position to the left or right of the center.

But it's what you called the "preachers" that are really causing the frustration and annoyance with their "my opinions are facts and if you don't agree with them you don't know anything" mentality. It's impossible to have a meaningful debate with those type of people (who never budge an inch on their position, but their constant temper-tantrums are even killing the debate for the rest of us who joined a discussion forum to discuss!

[O-ZoNe]

Thats the point. Some members need to realize one match against Italy will not fix anything. Iran learned much more playing Guinea than we learned from playing Brazil in a sponsored friendly. We adapted our team to African stamina levels after the friendly and got a point against Nigeria. If we play teams one or two levels above us consistently our players benefit far more. Imagine if we played Ghana and Croatia as well before the WC. We would have taken Bosnia the last game and finished Nigeria off when they aimlessly passed around in the second half.


Teams we gain nothing from playing: All Middle East Arabs bar UAE(Arab slow pace of play makes us slower.), any eastern african country, SouthEast Asian teams, one times versus a nation with a B team after we pay 1.5 million.


Teams we do gain a lot from:

1) West Africa(Ghana, Ivory Coast, Nigeria, etc), all of North Africa(Egypt is always good/Algeria smoked South Korea),

2) Virtually ANY team from CONMEBOL ( we arent paying Chile 1.5 million) and top CONCACAF sides(Mexico, Costa Rica, Honduras),

3) Any team from Europe's top 30 nations. ( we couldnt beat Albania so lets focus on getting a flowing game against Montenegro/Albania first)

4) The Asian atypicals: China/Japan/Uzbekistan/Korea Republic/ Australia. The other teams are below TM by more than one level and only disrupt us practicing PASSING.

5) CAFF: Solely to respect the organization and find new players. On Non Fifa days we could arrange games where Taremi, Sharifi and co get so much experience in a TM shirt. Prive themselves there and CQ WILL bump them to the main squad

FOr the most part I agree with much of this post. I do want to add, that in my opinion we gain nothing from playing club teams, specially those like Orlando Pilates whose training pitch is worst than most of the pitches in Iran. While I see a point in travelling to these locations for conditioning reasons, I just can't see us not being able to get S. Africa NT to play us, particularly with CQ's connections...so why Orlando Pilates?

I also think we need to give respect to top teams. Of course, we would love to see Brazil's best lineup match our boys, but really, if you were Brazil, Germany, or even Russia, would you field your A team against Iran in a friendly in Dubai (where weather is not always ideal)? Most likely not. But playing Brazil B is probably better than 85% of the world teams regardless of A and B, and these matches can be confidence boosters if the results are favourable (as they were against Russia). So if the funds exists, such matches are not all bad. Plus the added bonus of playing such teams is the sponsorship revenues our broke federation can mop up.

I look at the success our Vball, Futsal, and Beach Soccer teams have had...and whether it's due to the nature of the tournaments, or whatever else, I notice they regularly face the "world's best" and have risen to become the world's best. TM can learn a lot from those 3 sports teams.