QUEIROZ vs BRANCO Discussion!

[sirvan]

Comparing only results achieved in Iran. I could care less he has worked for Real Madrid. I only follow and watch Iranian football with the exception of international tournaments of course.

You mean comparing how we lost 3-1 to Mexico and 2-0 against Portugal in the world cup ? Or losing against the likes of Jordan? How about barely making it out of the group for the Asian Cup 2004 after a dramatic draw against the mighty Oman (after being down 2-0), or barely making it out of the first round of the world cup qualification after a dramatic win against the mighty Jordan? No sir, there is no comparing the two

[Saam]

Substantive like your "contextual deficiencies" or substantive like actual stats? fact we spent more in 2014 and 2018 than we did in 2006. CQ salary alone should be substantive enough. Fact 2006 got better result than 2014. 25th vs 28th and we did not park the bus and have the lowest number of passes and shots ever and had a more difficult group with two top 10 seeds. Fact: our 2014 and 2018 teams had the most number of players playing abroad and had more depth than 2006. 2006 we had few talents and remaining players from golden generations who mostly did not play every game or all together. You happily give CQ credit for players playing abroad and having talent but you use the same to take credit away from another coach? I respect you giving credit and praising a coach but to demonize and insult someone else to do it is wrong. in the end all that remains is stats no one remembers any context.

LOL 2014 we had more players playing abroad than in 2006? And a deeper squad? Are you taking the piss? We had players like Beikzadeh (who would have played a key role had he not been injured), Heydari and Reza Haghighi in that squad lol. Maybe you should check before you say "fact"

And LOL at "few talents" in the 2006 squad. We had karimi, mahdavikia, hashemian, zandi, nekounam, rahman rezaei (all in their primes), Madanchi, Borhani, Kaebi, Nosrati, Shojaei, Teymourian (all solid young players) and then some decent backups like Khatibi and Enayati. We only lacked in the goalkeeper position and even then, Mirzapour was decent enough, especially against Portugal. That squad was better than 2018 and much much better than 2014. If you want to make an argument, at least substantiate it properly and not with BS. People on this forum follow Iranian football very closely and can scrutinize your "facts."

Also no, in 2006 we didn't have two top 10 seeds in our group. In fact, Mexico was a top 10 fifa-ranked team and Portugal was ranked 17th. You can argue that those should be reversed but regardless, there was only one top 10 seed in our group. You could even argue that the Bosnia team we faced in 2014 was better than that Mexico team because Mexico didn't have high level players like Pjanic and Dzeko in their squad. They had Marquez in defense in terms of star quality but overall they were good as a team. Plus, the Nigeria team we faced >>>>>>> Angola. Angola was one of the worst teams that has ever played in the World Cup and we couldn't beat them. Also, Argentina 2014 > Portugal 2006.

Here's a "fact." Way better squad in a group that was much worse than our 2018 group, and, in my opinion, around the same or marginally worse than our 2014 group, and we managed to lose to a team that we were pretty evenly matched with (Mexico) in a game we should've tied, and couldn't beat a team (almost lost to them actually) that was on the same level as a lot of the second-tier Asian teams we usually beat.

[persiangodfather]

I understand that opinions about coaches and players and team performances are often subjective. It really doesn't bother me that people have extreme and unfair views about coaches or players. of course I am guilty of that too. but what is troublesome for me is when some people feel entitled to decide for themselves who is a true fan and who is not. calling another fellow fan "anti-tm", or question their love or passion for TM. This shit has to stop! and carlos is not helping it (due to his divisive personality).

IMO, the reason behind this is that some of our fans equate TM with the coach and vice versa. so if or when Ali Karimi, Soroush Rafee, Branko, GN, peyrouvani, a journalist, a fan or whomever criticize Carlos, then for some fans, the critic is automatically someone who is anti-TM. the members who were here back in 2005-2006 may remember that we had the same problem bank then. but back then criticizing Branko equated being anti-TM, for some!

as far as the subject of this thread:

Carlos and branko are two professional coaches who get paid to do their job. I think both of them have done a very good job in their respective positions. Obviously Carlos Qeiroz has a high profile resume. for us, who never get a "top of the line" of anything, Carlos was closest to the "top of the line" as we were gonna get. My problem with Carlos is his personality which at times makes him act unprofessionally. His constant whining, when everyone knows that this TM has had the best support among ALL TM teams of the past! His constant infatuation with glorifying himself by putting down Iran and Iranians pretty much any chance he gets. if it was once or twice, one could say ok, what ever. but year after year, comment after comment, sarcasm, belittling, whining, self glorifying. it's too much.

I wish Carlos and TM all the best and I think we have a good shot at winning the cup, but I want CQ gone after this tournament, regardless of results. I don't give a rat's ass if he is the best coach in the history of football. and believe me, I don't want Branko or any coach working in Iran anywhere near TM.

Branko is not professional

[sam20]

We have more players playing in Europe now than ever before. I am not into assumptions and funky mathematics I only understand stats. I do not like to do this but I do not like to see people who served our country belittled and treated unfairly due to bias. You obviously are not old enough to remember that Iran has always been among the top teams in Asia. Cq results so far have been very disappointing to me. Hopefully though he will prove his caliber at this Asian Cup.

Didn't you see the results posted just above your post??? We were constantly struggling against weak teams under Branko, and like others have mentioned, every match was very stressful because we didn't have team cohesion or a good defence.

Branko had about 5 -6 players playing in Top European leagues, all at the same time! a few players in the Bundesliga, who were all key players for their clubs, Seria A (Rahman Rezai Centre back).
Even when he had both Karimi and Mahdavikia in their prime, he still struggled to beat teams like Bahrain, Oman, and Jordan - Do you see any of this happening now? - We only have ONE SINGLE player in a top league right now, and CQ is still COMPLETELY OUTPERFORMING Branko.

Branko got us 1 point against Angola, CQ got us 4 points in a group with Morocco, Spain, and Portugal, and nearly took us to round of 16.

What has been disappointing to you about CQ's results? The fact that he's only lost one competitive game in over 4 years, against Spain with a pure fluke deflection goal?

If you're disappointed with CQ's results, who's results have impressed you more and how on earth has this happened?

[persian-eagle-13]

Carlos and branko are two professional coaches who get paid to do their job. I think both of them have done a very good job in their respective positions. Obviously Carlos Qeiroz has a high profile resume. for us, who never get a "top of the line" of anything, Carlos was closest to the "top of the line" as we were gonna get. My problem with Carlos is his personality which at times makes him act unprofessionally. His constant whining, when everyone knows that this TM has had the best support among ALL TM teams of the past! His constant infatuation with glorifying himself by putting down Iran and Iranians pretty much any chance he gets. if it was once or twice, one could say ok, what ever. but year after year, comment after comment, sarcasm, belittling, whining, self glorifying. it's too much.

I agreed with you til this part. How do you know that he is getting everything he wants? it is all comparative, if you go back to Bronko, this same bronko (the marmolak that he is) was bitching and whinning all the time when he was a coach. He was always about getting the league stopped for friendlies etc..... I think the media in iran is a very pro SS and PP and they twist the truth. Between anyone in iran I trust CQ as he is more about getting results then to fill his own pocket. remember what dadkhan did for bronko, he bending forward and backward for him. and we know dadkhan is the most capable person in IFF in the last 30-40 years.

[RaginG Inferno]

You mean comparing how we lost 3-1 to Mexico and 2-0 against Portugal in the world cup ? Or losing against the likes of Jordan? How about barely making it out of the group for the Asian Cup 2004 after a dramatic win against the mighty Oman, or barely making it out of the first round after a dramatic win against the mighty Jordan? No sir, there is no comparing the two

We actually drew with Oman. We only beat Thailand in the group stage.

[sam20]

Carlos and branko are two professional coaches who get paid to do their job. I think both of them have done a very good job in their respective positions. Obviously Carlos Qeiroz has a high profile resume. for us, who never get a "top of the line" of anything, Carlos was closest to the "top of the line" as we were gonna get. My problem with Carlos is his personality which at times makes him act unprofessionally. His constant whining, when everyone knows that this TM has had the best support among ALL TM teams of the past! His constant infatuation with glorifying himself by putting down Iran and Iranians pretty much any chance he gets. if it was once or twice, one could say ok, what ever. but year after year, comment after comment, sarcasm, belittling, whining, self glorifying. it's too much.

I wish Carlos and TM all the best and I think we have a good shot at winning the cup, but I want CQ gone after this tournament, regardless of results. I don't give a rat's ass if he is the best coach in the history of football. and believe me, I don't want Branko or any coach working in Iran anywhere near TM.

The reason CQ has gotten what he wants is because he has the courage to stand up to IFF and demand what he wants, and they listen because he brings the results (2 world cups in a row, 12 games without conceding, 1 point behind spain and portugal, etc.).

Belittling Iran? Is that how you perceive his comments? - This is called being professional. He sees the reality: Other teams have WAY better preparation than us prior to these tournaments, much better friendlies, and much better financial support. Therefore, these teams like Japan, Korea, and Australia are more well-prepared than Iran for these tournaments, and it's logically true.

He also wants to keep us grounded so we realize we always have to play our best, and that's why we don't lose to weaker teams like Bahrain and Jordan anymore. We don't go into it thinking we've already won.

Haven't you heard all the amazing things he's said about Iran and it's people, and team melli? - "I have a feeling of belonging to this country and it's people" "our team makes me proud and fights till the very end, with great determination"

Carlos Queiroz is PROFESSIONAL, and we're not used to having this kind of coach - That's the difference between him and other low-grade coaches like Branko.

If you want Carlos Queiroz out, then good luck getting Mourinho, Guardiola, or Diego Simeone, because these are the next calibre of coaches who can potentially be better for us than CQ, and they will not come to iran.

[NFL]

Make the poll to get your evidence. Ask "Were you confident that TM would win against Persian Gulf \ Arab teams prior to CQ?"

What you present doesn't prove anything since most prediction threads have guys bsing and making predictions like Iran wins by 100! Iran 99 - KSA 0. But since you wanted me to give you evidence...:

http://www.persianfootball.com/forum...hlight=bahrain
http://www.persianfootball.com/forum...hlight=bahrain
http://www.persianfootball.com/forum...hlight=bahrain

The last thread is right around when CQ took over and members will still not super confident due to the previous 5 years of mismanagement and poor results. My argument with you is that post WC2006 - April 2011, TM fans were worried \ nervous \ stressed about playing Teams such as Bahrain, Qatar, Kuwait, Iraq, Jordan, etc. Please keep our discussion in context. I see that a few members have also expressed my sentiment in this thread regarding their concern with TM performance during that period.

Last time I checked this is a forum so If I or any member wants to comment on a post such as yours they are free to do so. And like i said before were a couple days away from the AC cup and you still cant put your bias aside and root for TM.

Roo ke neest , sange pa ghazvineh bekhoda..


I can't make a man pretending to be blind see anything. as in my "rooting" for TM in my last post on this thread. please tell me, how and where did you root for TM?

[persian-eagle-13]

we are namak nashnash nation, we have to wait til CQ leaves, then we will say "long live CQ", bring CQ back.


Just watch!!

I will mark this threat, and will remind everyone when the time comes.

[tooleh khers]

You mean comparing how we lost 3-1 to Mexico and 2-0 against Portugal in the world cup ? Or losing against the likes of Jordan? How about barely making it out of the group for the Asian Cup 2004 after a dramatic win against the mighty Oman, or barely making it out of the first round after a dramatic win against the mighty Jordan? No sir, there is no comparing the two

I mean this:



2004 it does not mention we barely made it out of the group it mentions 3rd place finish vs 6th place finish for CQ. Worst finish ever. We lost to a country that was invaded by Isis. CQ lost to Isis. In 2006 we finished higher 25th than we did in 2014 (28th). Our FIFA ranking was 15 as opposed to 28. Do not shoot the messenger. I am not Branko's aunt or mother. It is stats! Branko for now is sarvareh CQ as far as Iranian football is concerned. I hope Cq wins the Asian cup and we can all praise him for being the best coach ever and then so on with every other coach.

[Pouya]

Even though I agree with a lot of your post, why don't you like a defensive style of play?

We play a very European style disciplined football which is great to watch, I find it much more enjoyable than the deimi, bezan bebeneem chi misheh football in the past. Seeing the unit and players in sync moving together, it's like a phalanx formation

I absolutely respect and appreciate a defensive style of play that CQ plays, which is very similar to Mourinho's or Simeone's preference. It's a more organized style which takes a lot of organization, relies on team work and not on individual talent much. The only reason I personally don't like it is because I've always liked South American Football more than European football as it's more technical and you'd see a lot more individual creativity that is attractive to me. It's essentially just a personal taste rather than a better style.

[tooleh khers]

LOL 2014 we had more players playing abroad than in 2006? And a deeper squad? Are you taking the piss? We had players like Beikzadeh (who would have played a key role had he not been injured), Heydari and Reza Haghighi in that squad lol. Maybe you should check before you say "fact"

And LOL at "few talents" in the 2006 squad. We had karimi, mahdavikia, hashemian, zandi, nekounam, rahman rezaei (all in their primes), Madanchi, Borhani, Kaebi, Nosrati, Shojaei, Teymourian (all solid young players) and then some decent backups like Khatibi and Enayati. We only lacked in the goalkeeper position and even then, Mirzapour was decent enough, especially against Portugal. That squad was better than 2018 and much much better than 2014. If you want to make an argument, at least substantiate it properly and not with BS. People on this forum follow Iranian football very closely and can scrutinize your "facts."

Also no, in 2006 we didn't have two top 10 seeds in our group. In fact, Mexico was a top 10 fifa-ranked team and Portugal was ranked 17th. You can argue that those should be reversed but regardless, there was only one top 10 seed in our group. You could even argue that the Bosnia team we faced in 2014 was better than that Mexico team because Mexico didn't have high level players like Pjanic and Dzeko in their squad. They had Marquez in defense in terms of star quality but overall they were good as a team. Plus, the Nigeria team we faced >>>>>>> Angola. Angola was one of the worst teams that has ever played in the World Cup and we couldn't beat them. Also, Argentina 2014 > Portugal 2006.

Here's a "fact." Way better squad in a group that was much worse than our 2018 group, and, in my opinion, around the same or marginally worse than our 2014 group, and we managed to lose to a team that we were pretty evenly matched with (Mexico) in a game we should've tied, and couldn't beat a team (almost lost to them actually) that was on the same level as a lot of the second-tier Asian teams we usually beat.

Please dont LOL when you are incorrect. We had 7 legionaries in 2006, we had 9 legionaries in 2014 and 2018 more than both. Mahdavikia, Zandi and Karimi were all injured and not in their primes. Nekounam had not moved to Europe yet according to wiki. Main point is 9 is more than 7.

Correction I mixed up the rankings with seedings. I meant top 10 ranked in the world. The rest please refer to this:



yes it omits 2018 but the rest is very clear. Hard to argue with stats unless you are bias and at that point we have nothing to discuss. I concede as I supposedly did with KC.

[Pouya]

Lol guys, I've revised Toole's favourite comparison to exclude irrelevant tournaments as well as an updated version. Enjoy


P.S. Our current ranking is 29th.

[Dubxl152]

Lol guys, I've revised Toole's favourite comparison to exclude irrelevant tournaments as well as an updated version. Enjoy

I cant open it. can you post as an img?

[Pouya]

done