QUEIROZ vs BRANCO Discussion!

[DR Strangemoosh]

doctor, you forgot to mention how Branko destroyed Mobali's, Borhani's and Kazemian's footballing career in this post!
is everything alright?

Do you genuinely think CQ has been a bad coach for TM from a long term perspective? In terms of sowing seeds for the future?
I think we should always be free to criticize people, I have disagreed strongly with CQ on many decisions he's made.
But I just don't understand you, context is for Kings and the context is that we finally have a disciplined TM which plays professionally. What do you have against this?
Why do you support Branko so much , a guy who has been only a malignancy for TM from end of 2005 onwards.

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This post and some of the following posts were moved from "TM News Thread" into this new thread, since they no longer serve the purpose of the original thread, where they were posted initially, and open up a new discussion!

Please keep the TM News Thread only for TM News!
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- Adesor

[tooleh khers]

QUEIROZ vs BRANCO Discussion!

Do you genuinely think CQ has been a bad coach for TM from a long term perspective? In terms of sowing seeds for the future?

I think we should always be free to criticize people, I have disagreed strongly with CQ on many decisions he's made.

But I just don't understand you, context is for Kings and the context is that we finally have a disciplined TM which plays professionally. What do you have against this?

Why do you support Branko so much , a guy who has been only a malignancy for TM from end of 2005 onwards.

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[Dubxl152]

doosteh aziz, this comment wasn't coming from some half ass Iranian coach, or someone of no significance, this is Carlos Qeiroz saying that. He is a top class coach, everything that he says is reflected in the football media in the region, if not the world. If an Iranian behaved the way he did we'd be shitting on him left right and center, but when this guy does it, we say he is telling the truth when in fact it's a big lie??
He knows his words cause "reactions", that's why he is choosing his words the way he does. He is setting things up for later.

How is it a lie? Do you have facts that represent the 80% number to be false or is that your opinion? Maybe you're lying.

Make a poll and ask members how many people were afraid of losing to Bahrain, UAE, Syria, Qatar, Saudi, Iraq after WC 2006 - April 2011 when CQ took over. I think you would be surprised by the results. Fact is members and people were afraid of losing to these teams and you can find evidence in the results during that period when IRAN was the favorite on paper but due to poor prep, mentality and ultimately coaching we would draw or lose against these opponents.

Lets see here:

26 Jul 2006 Iran v Iraq D 0-0 West Asian Football Federation Championship
28 Jul 2006 Iran v United Arab Emirates D 0-0 West Asian Football Federation Championship
30 Jul 2006 Palestine v Iran D 0-0 West Asian Football Federation Championship
16 Aug 2006 Iran v Syria D 1-1 AFC Asian Cup
06 Oct 2006 Jordan v Iran D 0-0 LG Middle East / Africa Peace Cup
16 Jun 2007 Iran v Iraq D 0-0 West Asian Football Federation Championship
15 Jul 2007 China PR v Iran D 2-2 AFC Asian Cup
06 Feb 2008 Iran v Syria D 0-0 FIFA World Cup
21 Mar 2008 Bahrain v Iran L 1-0 International Friendly
26 Mar 2008 Kuwait v Iran D 2-2 FIFA World Cup
02 Jun 2008 Iran v United Arab Emirates D 0-0 FIFA World Cup
06 Sep 2008 Saudi Arabia v Iran D 1-1 FIFA World Cup
19 Nov 2008 United Arab Emirates v Iran D 1-1 FIFA World Cup
28 Jan 2009 Thailand v Iran D 0-0 AFC Asian Cup
28 Mar 2009 Iran v Saudi Arabia L 1-2 FIFA World Cup
06 Jun 2009 Korea DPR v Iran D 0-0 FIFA World Cup
31 Aug 2009 Bahrain v Iran L 4-2 International Friendly
05 Sep 2009 Uzbekistan v Iran D 0-0 International Friendly
22 Nov 2009 Jordan v Iran L 1-0 AFC Asian Cup
28 Dec 2009 Qatar v Iran L 3-2 International Friendly
28 Sep 2010 Oman v Iran D 2-2 International Friendly
03 Oct 2010 Iran v Kuwait L 1-2 International Friendly

I included friendlies because you're one of our members who loves to jump all over friendly results and use them as evidence when it in your favor. Fact is Iran was an inconstant side that had trouble beating mediocre gulf sides before CQ. Im not say we didn't beat them im saying we were inconsistent and every time we played them its was 90 mins of stress and heart attacks. Majority of members who were around would agree with that sentiment \ experience.

[tooleh khers]

22 year old was the player of the year in Iran when he was left out of Iran's 2006 world cup squad in favour of people like Khatibi. I guess you don't like young players being blooded. I just want to imagine current TM under branko because we wouldn't have an experienced and still young Beiranvand let alone Majid Hosseini (who I disagreed with being picked and thought CQ was crazy), Azmoun, Torabi, Taremi, Gholizadeh etc... All being given chances and experience earlier than expected by a coach who trusts youth and talent. Look now what he does with Niazmand.

Compare with branko who kept on starting with an awful Mirzapour even in the most meaningless friendlies when we had the likes of a 23 year old Rahmati ...

BTW you never respond to my arguments so why shouldnt I keep posting them until you and other brankoholics give a cogent answer


Is everything alright?

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[Iran_19]

You either are not old enough to remember what kind of team Branko had in his hand vs what kind of team Queiroz had up to even 2015 or you are simply biased.

Branko had a team of Daei, Kia, Karimi, Nekounam, Ando, Hashemian, Rezaei who played or were playing football at the highest level in Europe. Right now we have only JB who play at the highest level!!

[Philosophy_King]

How is it a lie? Do you have facts that represent the 80% number to be false or is that your opinion? Maybe you're lying.
Make a poll and ask members how many people were afraid of losing to Bahrain, UAE, Syria, Qatar, Saudi, Iraq after WC 2006 - April 2011 when CQ took over. I think you would be surprised by the results. Fact is members and people were afraid of losing to these teams and you can find evidence in the results during that period when IRAN was the favorite on paper but due to poor prep, mentality and ultimately coaching we would draw or lose against these opponents.
Lets see here:

26 Jul 2006 Iran v Iraq D 0-0 West Asian Football Federation Championship
28 Jul 2006 Iran v United Arab Emirates D 0-0 West Asian Football Federation Championship
30 Jul 2006 Palestine v Iran D 0-0 West Asian Football Federation Championship
16 Aug 2006 Iran v Syria D 1-1 AFC Asian Cup
06 Oct 2006 Jordan v Iran D 0-0 LG Middle East / Africa Peace Cup
16 Jun 2007 Iran v Iraq D 0-0 West Asian Football Federation Championship
15 Jul 2007 China PR v Iran D 2-2 AFC Asian Cup
06 Feb 2008 Iran v Syria D 0-0 FIFA World Cup
21 Mar 2008 Bahrain v Iran L 1-0 International Friendly
26 Mar 2008 Kuwait v Iran D 2-2 FIFA World Cup
02 Jun 2008 Iran v United Arab Emirates D 0-0 FIFA World Cup
06 Sep 2008 Saudi Arabia v Iran D 1-1 FIFA World Cup
19 Nov 2008 United Arab Emirates v Iran D 1-1 FIFA World Cup
28 Jan 2009 Thailand v Iran D 0-0 AFC Asian Cup
28 Mar 2009 Iran v Saudi Arabia L 1-2 FIFA World Cup
06 Jun 2009 Korea DPR v Iran D 0-0 FIFA World Cup
31 Aug 2009 Bahrain v Iran L 4-2 International Friendly
05 Sep 2009 Uzbekistan v Iran D 0-0 International Friendly
22 Nov 2009 Jordan v Iran L 1-0 AFC Asian Cup
28 Dec 2009 Qatar v Iran L 3-2 International Friendly
28 Sep 2010 Oman v Iran D 2-2 International Friendly
03 Oct 2010 Iran v Kuwait L 1-2 International Friendly

I included friendlies because you're one of our members who loves to jump all over friendly results and use them as evidence when it in your favor. Fact is Iran was an inconstant side that had trouble beating mediocre gulf sides before CQ. Im not say we didn't beat them im saying we were inconsistent and every time we played them its was 90 mins of stress and heart attacks. Majority of members who were around would agree with that sentiment \ experience.

OMG! Never want to see TM that weak again! It felt like we were galaxies behind Korea&Japan!

[tooleh khers]

You either are not old enough to remember what kind of team Branko had in his hand vs what kind of team Queiroz had up to even 2015 or you are simply biased.

Branko had a team of Daei, Kia, Karimi, Nekounam, Ando, Hashemian, Rezaei who played or were playing football at the highest level in Europe. Right now we have only JB who play at the highest level!!

We have more players playing in Europe now than ever before. I am not into assumptions and funky mathematics I only understand stats. I do not like to do this but I do not like to see people who served our country belittled and treated unfairly due to bias. You obviously are not old enough to remember that Iran has always been among the top teams in Asia. Cq results so far have been very disappointing to me. Hopefully though he will prove his caliber at this Asian Cup.

[tooleh khers]

Not to that one game. To the results and performance overall.

[Omids]

Who gives a toss about Branko, especailly just before the Asia Cup? I dont.

I have been following TM from 1997 when i went to the Iran vs Aus game in Melbourne. And there is a night & day difference between bronko's TM to CQ's TM. Now i look forward to compete with the elite of Asia and the rest of the world. During Bronko time i would have sleepless nights when we were playing the 2nd & 3rd tier of Asian football. Hope we never see that TM ever again. Now the world takes notice when iran plays, no matter who we are playing against. Enough said.

[Dubxl152]

We have more players playing in Europe now than ever before. I am not into assumptions and funky mathematics I only understand stats. I do not like to do this but I do not like to see people who served our country belittled and treated unfairly due to bias. You obviously are not old enough to remember that Iran has always been among the top teams in Asia. Cq results so far have been very disappointing to me. Hopefully though he will prove his caliber at this Asian Cup.

CQ motivated these players to move to Europe. When he took over TM in 2011 we had an aging Javad, and a broken Masoud playing in Spain other than that we hadn't sent anyone of significance aboard since 2006. The man has literally mentored our players to go abroad. There are interviews from our players attesting to this fact. So your stat of us having more players in Europe than ever before is 100% accurate just keep in mind the reasons why.

Branko inherited (arguably) the most talented TM in history. He had a cake walk of a WC group in which he lost control of the squad and flopped hard. He then ran away and refused to come back to Iran. The man didn't event do a single interview, a sorry i failed, these were my challenges thanks for the opportunity interview.

Iran has been one of the tops teams in Asia you're right but in its history it has failed to live up to its abilities. CQ is the only coach in TM history to make it to back to back WC's and has also come home with the most points from a WC.

You might hate CQ's style, his attitude and personality. But you cant argue with facts:

Inherited team and organization in decline. Instilled discipline in historically over emotional side. Got world class infrastructure and training facilities build for TM (PEC). Qualified to back to back WC for the first time in TM history, and got more points in the WC than any previous manager in TM history.

[NFL]

How is it a lie? Do you have facts that represent the 80% number to be false or is that your opinion? Maybe you're lying.

Make a poll and ask members how many people were afraid of losing to Bahrain, UAE, Syria, Qatar, Saudi, Iraq after WC 2006 - April 2011 when CQ took over. I think you would be surprised by the results. Fact is members and people were afraid of losing to these teams and you can find evidence in the results during that period when IRAN was the favorite on paper but due to poor prep, mentality and ultimately coaching we would draw or lose against these opponents.

Lets see here:

26 Jul 2006 Iran v Iraq D 0-0 West Asian Football Federation Championship
28 Jul 2006 Iran v United Arab Emirates D 0-0 West Asian Football Federation Championship
30 Jul 2006 Palestine v Iran D 0-0 West Asian Football Federation Championship
16 Aug 2006 Iran v Syria D 1-1 AFC Asian Cup
06 Oct 2006 Jordan v Iran D 0-0 LG Middle East / Africa Peace Cup
16 Jun 2007 Iran v Iraq D 0-0 West Asian Football Federation Championship
15 Jul 2007 China PR v Iran D 2-2 AFC Asian Cup
06 Feb 2008 Iran v Syria D 0-0 FIFA World Cup
21 Mar 2008 Bahrain v Iran L 1-0 International Friendly
26 Mar 2008 Kuwait v Iran D 2-2 FIFA World Cup
02 Jun 2008 Iran v United Arab Emirates D 0-0 FIFA World Cup
06 Sep 2008 Saudi Arabia v Iran D 1-1 FIFA World Cup
19 Nov 2008 United Arab Emirates v Iran D 1-1 FIFA World Cup
28 Jan 2009 Thailand v Iran D 0-0 AFC Asian Cup
28 Mar 2009 Iran v Saudi Arabia L 1-2 FIFA World Cup
06 Jun 2009 Korea DPR v Iran D 0-0 FIFA World Cup
31 Aug 2009 Bahrain v Iran L 4-2 International Friendly
05 Sep 2009 Uzbekistan v Iran D 0-0 International Friendly
22 Nov 2009 Jordan v Iran L 1-0 AFC Asian Cup
28 Dec 2009 Qatar v Iran L 3-2 International Friendly
28 Sep 2010 Oman v Iran D 2-2 International Friendly
03 Oct 2010 Iran v Kuwait L 1-2 International Friendly

I included friendlies because you're one of our members who loves to jump all over friendly results and use them as evidence when it in your favor. Fact is Iran was an inconstant side that had trouble beating mediocre gulf sides before CQ. Im not say we didn't beat them im saying we were inconsistent and every time we played them its was 90 mins of stress and heart attacks. Majority of members who were around would agree with that sentiment \ experience.

You are all over the place and I don't want to derail the discussion, but please, I want you to show me just one such occasion where I used the result of a friendly as evidence of anything!!
I don't even use results of official games as evidence, never mind friendlies.
I believe you got me mixed up with someone else.

the "80% of Iranians were afraid to play Bahrain" is a lie that Carlos pulled out of his ass. You and a few CQ worshipers and Branko haters are not 80% of the Iranians. it's simple math.

[Roxanaz80]

You're both wrong: its doogh

It's dairy related whatever it is. Or it's the kood.

[DR Strangemoosh]

LOLL! I am not old enough, bashe lol, shoma chan salete?
We have players who play in some half a$$ 2nd or 3rd rated European leagues and some are not even starters vs teams under Branko which had:
Karimi @ Bayern
Zandi @ k'Lautern
Mahdavikia @ HSV
Rahman @ Serie A
and both Ando and Nekounam joined Bolton and Osasuna right after WC.
We were best team in Asia? How come we made it only once to WC between 2000 to 2014??!? and finished only ONCE among top 4 teams in Asia between 2000 up to now?!
Queiroz gave identity to this team which was previously ruined by Branko's stupid mistakes to play old or useless players in different competitions!

These people are absolutely unbelievable....

How can they not appreciate or value the long term paradigm shift in terms of how we play football, let alone the difference in terms of players available?

CQ's faults aside, how can Branko be compared to him? Why don't people appreciate sowing seeds and building something rather than destroying something?

In any case, we will all have to shut up in a few days time, I'm just sad that we have people who can't appreciate what they have.

[Dubxl152]

You are all over the place and I don't want to derail the discussion, but please, I want you to show me just one such occasion where I used the result of a friendly as evidence of anything!!
I don't even use results of official games as evidence, never mind friendlies.
I believe you got me mixed up with someone else.

the "80% of Iranians were afraid to play Bahrain" is a lie that Carlos pulled out of his ass. You and a few CQ worshipers and Branko haters are not 80% of the Iranians. it's simple math.

LOl you don't want to derail the discussion but make inflammatory posts and when you get called out with historical results from the period in question you getting triggered like trump on twitter, did i present you with fake news (results)? You become active before every major tournament trying to stir the pot, clinging to every off hand statement CQ or anyone makes and try to twist it to push your agenda of having a home grown coach or any coach that would be cheaper etc etc.

Look i presented you with historical results of how weak TM was before CQ, which is why the majority of TM fans who followed TM in that period were worried about playing gulf countries. Its the truth its was nerve racking playing those teams. Please show me your simple math and can quantify a feeling. You and the 20% of "fans" that want to see TM fail so you can get your way are not the majority.

[DR Strangemoosh]

Explaining the difference between these two coaches isn't rocket science...

It's about the future of TM and the building blocks for future successes - the current squad is being built as a long term project which I consider to be in the third phase, I hope we win this Asian Cup but even if we don't, I'm confident with the disciplined phalanx-formation we have and the new players being blooded in every position that our future is bright. CQ may not be around after this cup but whoever inherits this squad has so much of a better set-up and atmosphere compared to when Branko left. Do you disagree with this?

Branko took probably the most talented squad we have ever had and left it a shell of what it should have been. I love our young talents from Azmoun, JB, Ghoddos to Gholizadeh and Torabi, and maintain that Sardar has potentially world class traits. But the fact remains that they are still a long way in terms of being complete players compared to the big players we had during that period and who Branko inherited from Ciro. All of our talents still have a lot of improvements to make and touch wood they will make them.

On another note, Asian Games and West Asian Cup etc... are not worth 1/12th of a world cup point, why even include those in the argument? The value of these games are to give confidence and experience to our youth.