(#POLL) Comparing coaches thread: Who is the best? Skocic, Wilmotz, CQ, Branko, Daei,

[Keshwardoost]

Hope people continues their coach comparings in this thread,

Also plz, answer the poll, lets settle it and se what PFDC think!


SO: Who is best? I say 1. CQ, 2, Skocic, 3 Daei, Branko, Talebi then: Mayeli Kohan, , Gholmo.. and the rest

1. Coming world cup, Skocic can come up to same level or eaven pass CQ. all depends on how TM stands vs tougher opponents.

2. CQ has legend status, and Skocic is very close now to that aswell. could argue for that he has legend status, but i dont yet since he first must pllay WC, and not make a saudi result, and instead a result we can be proud of. then he has legend status for me.

3. Every thing is possible cuz of CQ

4. Skocic has done a fantastic job


Edit. it should say: write (not wright) in comment section, if your choice is other than the names i picked, i will then count those name in, poll closes in 7 days.


3. 2. 1. GO

[Keshwardoost]

Also, Daei is the best talent spotter, then its CQ..
In all categories, Wilmotz is the worst. = probably the one thing that whole PFDC can agree on except supporting TM
we maybe have to thank wilmotz,bcuz if it wasnt for him, maybe iff wouldnt wake up and handle corruption in hiring agents. maybe it came something good out if it avfter all, big short time money lost, but long time maybe a lot of money saved in dalals exposed.. (wishful thinking?)


TM played nice footy with Daei, but he was inexperianced, we lost to saudis and got late goals scored against us.. footbalwise it was sometimes very nice football though..
found alot of talents. had the balls to take TM in a poor shape, alwayz respect for that.

now with experiance, probably even better, hope he has taken fifa coaching classes aswell.. can be a future big man for TM, but would probably have to take care of another TM to earn peoples respect in Iran first.

Daei for Uae or something would be interesting.. then if he makes some sick results, like Branko with Oman, maybe media wouldnt go after him eaven before the first game.. since he has alot of old enemies..

[AGC]

Hope people continues their coach comparings in this thread,

Also plz, answer the poll, lets settle it and se what PFDC think!

SO: Who is best? I say 1. CQ, 2, Skocic, 3 Daei, Branko, Talebi then: Mayeli Kohan, , Gholmo.. and the rest

1. Coming world cup, Skocic can come up to same level or eaven pass CQ. all depends on how TM stands vs tougher opponents.

2. CQ has legend status, and Skocic is very close now to that aswell. could argue for that he has legend status, but i dont yet since he first must pllay WC, and not make a saudi result, and instead a result we can be proud of. then he has legend status for me.

3. Every thing is possible cuz of CQ

4. Skocic has done a fantastic job


3. 2. 1. GO

Thank you for opening this thread! I really mean it.

These comparisons were starting to dilute other discussions!

[DR Strangemoosh]

Queiroz is a legend who revolutionised our football. No one compares to what he did.

Skocic is doing very well in the current time.

Respect Ivic too. I trust the players in each era and what they say.

[Keshwardoost]

Queiroz is a legend who revolutionised our football. No one compares to what he did.

Skocic is doing very well in the current time.

Respect Ivic too. I trust the players in each era and what they say.

Yes, I agree 100 %

its sometimes no use to compare when they reach a certain level, its just better to appreciate them instead. + its different from era to era as everything changes..
Yes, respect to Ivic aswell.

[Keshwardoost]

Thank you for opening this thread! I really mean it.

These comparisons were starting to dilute other discussions!

Thx AGC jan, yeah I felt exactly as you.. thought its better to just make a thread + a interesting poll. lets settle it for once, and then make another poll next year.

[Lorestani]

1. Pressing
As far as I remember the team hardly pressed the opponent up the field.
Striker defending is different from pressing up the field, as I'm sure you'd know.
If any CQ's strikers defended, it was closer to the halfway line rather than the opponents' box.
I frankly can't remember seeing a high press under CQ.
Maybe against extremely weak opponents. Even that I can't remember


2. Tactics and game plans.
You're right that some coaches adopt their gameplans according to the opponents characteristics, weaknesses and strengths.
But some coaches have a differing philosophy: Do what you do best and keep at it. And if that bears fruit, why change?
You can't deny it has borne fruit so far.
It's just two different approaches.


3. I didn't say anything about worshipping CQ or X or Y.
I myself do admire and appreciate what he did for us, TM an how he brought the much needed discipline and order to a chaotic TM
What I said was many PPL allow the fame N name of then coach to cloud their judgement and act not based on performance but th name of the person. And tha is wrong

First, on pressing, go back and rewatch some games. Especially when Ando was around, there was concerted pressing all the time and he would orchestrate it, just like Müller is doing these days at Bayern.

2. Yes, I agree with you that it's different philosophies. Jogi Löw, for example, failed trying to adopt CQ's approach at the Euros 2012 in the semi-final against Italy, when he ordered Toni Kroos to man-mark Pirlo. That plan backfired and Löw drew heavy criticism for it. You are also right that Skocic has been very successful so far. I just don't believe that, going forward, he'll have the same level of success with his rigidity against stronger teams. It's Branko with his favorite eleven in every game all over again. The jury is out, so we'll have evidence in the coming months and then can come back and re-evaluate who was right or wrong.

3. I have little to say there. It's a general point you are making and I don't feel I am the right person to respond to that, as I don't think I belong to that camp you are criticizing.

[AGC]

Now that we have an appropriate thread for these discussions I will give my point of view regarding our coaches!

For me CQ was good at what he did. He is a true legend but couldn't qualify for 16 in WC and choked at two consecutive asian cups. These chokings were in my humble opinion a result based on two things.

1. He instilled some rigorous discipline in the TM players, but as we all know, it's not just about good moral values, kids/players/students look at the seniors and act like them. When CQ showed his temper then he kind of gave green light for outbursts etc. Overall he minimized those toxic behaviours but the players had problems keeping composure and keeping calm at vital games. Iraq, Japan etc.

2. He was a good defensive minded coach, and he mastered the parking bus game. I got my hopes up that he could handle transitioning from closing games to open playing when I saw his last game against Korea in Azadi. But overall I saw my hopes get crushed. Against Sweden, Bosnia, Japan etc.

To sum it up CQ was good for the moment we had him, but after 8 years it became clear that he would not move the team forward. To his defence the players today are much better than they were under this helm. Azmoun was not the Azmoun of today, neither was Taremi etc. On the other hand we had better central defenders. My point is that he had worse offensive options.

Regarding Skocic:

1. He has qualified in style. He plays good open football. He is undefeated and handles pressure better than CQ. I bet the team would choke if CQ would be at the helm at the time Sko got installed as HC.

2. He has yet to prove himself against better opponents. But right now it looks good. The game against SK, on another day the scoreboard would've been 3-1 or 3-2 in our favour. Will he handle higher caliber opponents better? He has better players at his disposal, the players have experience and routine and less respect to big teams. This generation does not shit their pants against Europeans. Our Euro based players whip CL-calibre opponents ass on routine. Look at that kid allahyar against Leicester, Azmoun against Chelsea, Taremi against Chelsea and Juve. This WC will be a success i think.

[oracle]

carlos q by far.
1.When he taked over our national
team it was worst than anytime
in our history combanition of bad result
and very little choice of players
I OFFICIALLY DECLARE that time
us darkest time in our football history.
when cq left wehad 3 team melli
2team melli in the same level
end of BAZIKON salari.
result wise
2 back to back wc first time in history
almost tied oreven might of beat argentina if we had var
in one w.c.
2015 a.c it wasnt for hometown ref knocking iran out of asian cup minimum semi finalwas possible.
2018wc q easiest qualification in our history compare to othe campaign .
2018 wc in group of death
got 4pt and coupleinch of aways from advancing in our group which i promise u all we might nt get 4pt in te next
10 world cups hope i am wrong.

2019 ac first ac smifinal in15 years .

CARLOS Q. GREATEST THING HAPPEN TO IRAN
SINCE TABRIZ BAZZAR INVENTED CHOLO KABAB.

[AGC]

Oh I see I didn't answer the question. Based on it being a closed chapter I'll go for CQ. That is the only fair option at this moment. Skocic has to be tested in AC. If he wins AC or makes the semis then I'll go for Skocic, but it remains to see!

Based on limited time frame of only qualifiers I give slight advantage to Skocic. Yes CQ took over at a historic low. On the other hand Skocic took over a complete mess with the knife against TMs throat whoop some ass. His record does not lie.

Overall: CQ.

[Malkay]

Wilmots . What a click bait title.

Has to be CQ. The way the team evolved under him (look at some of the names in his early squads outside of an aging Karimi, Nekounam and Hosseini) and how he restored a culture of our players pursuing careers in European leagues is what the current manager benefits from.

It's just a shame his combative personality and flair for the dramatics (how many times did he threaten to quit the job on his Facebook page?) complemented our amateurish football federation, providing an unwanted side show from the good work he did. He's still doing it with Egypt now. It will always taint his legacy with us. As will the 2019 Asian Cup and his last game. We should have won that tournament. He has no excuses.

[Keshwardoost]

Wilmots . What a click bait title.
Has to be CQ. The way the team evolved under him (look at some of the names in his early squads outside of an aging Karimi, Nekounam and Hosseini) and how he restored a culture of our players pursuing careers in European leagues is what the current manager benefits from.
It's just a shame his combative personality and flair for the dramatics (how many times did he threaten to quit the job on his Facebook page?) complemented our amateurish football federation, providing an unwanted side show from the good work he did. He's still doing it with Egypt now. It will always taint his legacy with us. As will the 2019 Asian Cup and his last game. We should have won that tournament. He has no excuses.

it was close that I wrote Potter aswell, but then it wouldnt be TM coaches.. so had to erase him

[Philosophy_King]

I am not sure what you mean by "totally unconvincing. Both in chess and football, you always win because your opponent makes mistakes. By definition. If your opponent were perfect, you wouldn't win. Also I wouldn't call it "speculate". CQ analyzed China's weaknesses and exploited them. That's called awareness, not sure what your argument is here.

Ok let's give it another try: When you are playing chess on a high level, you will never expect your opponent to blunder his Queen or Rook in one move. Obviously Human Beings make mistakes in Chess, but you (maybe your are a GM?) and me won't capitalize on a mistake that Kasporov does, because we are not able to calculate 15-16 move ahead ( at least not me). Yet both of us will be able to see if someone just blunders his Queen in the next move, this doesn't signify that we are great tacticians. Hope you see my point.

Regarding CQ Analysis of China, did you had a chat with CQ about his Tactics for this game? Since you have mentions that CQ analyzed Chinas Games in AC 2019, None of their goals that they conceded had any pattern that would resemble the goals we scored against them. Nor does the Chances that Korea/Thailand/Philippines create against them resemble our goals. Keep also in mind, that we scored very similar goal against Oman, so according to your logic CQ had the same offensive game-plan for Oman and China, although they both have totally different style, which would be strange to propose for a Tactician that adapts to all the particularities of his opponent.

[Philosophy_King]

I wrote that CQ's deficiencies have prevented him from "becoming one of the top 5 coaches". So no, I would not rank CQ among the top 5.

It is not because of the deficiencies that you have indicate that CQ is not on par with Pep, Mourinho etc. It is because most of the above mentioned Coaches Won Champions-League, Spanish-League, Premier-League, Euros and World-Cups. CQ didn't won anything as a Head-Coach of a National-team yet and even if he succeeded in winning the Africa Cup, he won't be comparable to say Joachim Löw. Therefore it is strange that you claim that Löw was not succeeding in implementing CQ-Tactics in Euros 2012 against Italy, as if Parking The Bus and waiting for Counter was invented by CQ (or do your mean any other particular Tactics that Löw misunderstood in copay pasting CQ.)

[The]

Vieira the GOAT.

My guy picked up a lit cigarette butt a fan threw on the pitch and smoked it. No other manager is ever going to be that hard.